美版知乎：为什么其他国家的电子产品和智能手机竞争不过中国

Why can't other countries compete with China in the electronic and smartphone market?

为什么其他国家无法在电子产品和智能手机市场与中国竞争？

以下是Quora读者的评论：

Eddie Kwong

Because all the parts are made in China. They’ve learned how to make these parts cheaply and efficiently and they’ve spent 40 years building the infrastructure to support this. They have transportation, power generation, special economic zones, favorable laws and regulations for importing critical raw materials and exporting finished products… etc etc

The company I work for has factories in both India and in China. The China factory can build product from scratch to the shipping dock in 3 wks. It takes the India factory 11 weeks. India has to import components from China because Indian suppliers frequently miss dates or simply can’t make components of the same quality. Sometimes they ship the wrong components entirely. Indian engineers make mistakes which cause products to be returned. Every bug a firmware developer in India fixes, they create 5 more bugs. It takes 3–5 hours to ship something from Bangalore to Chennai because the transportation infrastructure are so bad. Then the product gets held up in India customs for days to weeks because of some bureaucratic red tape bullshit. Then, true story, products were supposed to ship from Chennai to California on a boat. The major port in California is Oakland. Oakland California. They somehow misprinted the bill of lading so that the shipment would go to Oakland Florida. Florida is on the EAST COAST of the US, and Oakland Florida is and INLAND small town of 3000 people with no port at all. How does that mistake get through the entire country of India without someone catching it? And why aren’t they fired or punished for their stupidity?

因为所有的零件都是中国制造的。他们已经学会了如何廉价高效地制造这些零部件，他们花了40年的时间来建设制造这些部件的基础设施。他们还制订了交通、发电、经济特区、重要原材料进口和成品出口等优惠法律法规。

我供职的公司在印度和中国都设有工厂。中国工厂可以在3周内将产品生产出来并送到码头。而印度工厂需要11周的时间。印度必须从中国进口零部件，因为印度供应商经常误了交期，或者根本无法生产出同样质量的零部件。有时它们还交错货。印度工程师犯的错误导致商品被退回。印度的固件开发人员每修复一个bug，都会产生另外5个bug。从班加罗尔到钦奈需要3-5个小时，因为交通基础设施实在太差了。又因为一些官僚主义的繁文缛节，这种商品还要在印度海关扣留了几天到几周的时间。然后，这是真事，商品本该用船从钦奈运到加利福尼亚的。加利福尼亚的主要港口是奥克兰，加州的奥克兰。他们却不知怎么地把提单打错了，把货物运往佛罗里达州的奥克兰。佛罗里达州位于美国东海岸，佛罗里达州的奥克兰是一个内陆小镇，只有3000人口，根本没有港口。这个错误卷会在没有人发现的情况下传遍整个印度？他们怎么不会因为愚蠢的错误而被解雇或惩罚呢？

 

Dev Gupta, PhD Engr. & Math (1984)

First you need to understand that even in a Chinese brand phone most of the complex high tech components used ( like the Application Processor, the Modem chip, the Radio Freq. module, … ) are of foreign design and manufacture ( Taiwan, US .. ). Only about half the manufacturing cost of brands like VIVO, Oppo etc. are from activities within China ( e,g. the Camera module by Aptina, this used to be a US company then was bought by China, the display and the Li ion battery, the simpler components like all the mechanical and electro mechanical parts … ). All the final assembly & testing of the Phones is done in China ( adds just 10 % to total cost ) which is how every current big brand ( even Samsung ) outside the US got started in the Mobile Phone business. Then there is the cost to license the operating system software which is typically Android licensed from Google.

首先，你要明白，即使在中国品牌的手机中，大多数复杂的高科技元件（如应用处理器、调制解调器芯片、射频模块等）都是国外设计和制造的（台湾、美国）。VIVO、Oppo等品牌的制造成本中，只有大约一半来自中国境内的制造加工（例如，镁光的相机模块，这原是一家美国公司，后被中国收购，显示器和锂离子电池，以及所有机械和机电部件等更简单的部件……）。所有手机的最终组装和测试都是在中国完成的（只占到总成本的10%），这也是目前美国以外的所有大品牌（甚至三星）在手机业务上的起步之道。然后是授权操作系统软件的成本，这些软件通常是由谷歌（Google）授权的Android系统。

Mobile phones were invented (1973) and till 2000 the worldwide business used to be dominated by Motorola, originally a US Co. but since 2012 a brand owned by Lenovo ( itself originally an IBM brand for their Laptops ) of China.

As the inventor of many of these technologies at Motorola in the US, back in 2004 and then again in 2012 ( after ex President Kalam had asked for it ) I had offered the Electronics Ministry of India to set up a complete ( incl. R&D for hardware, manufacturing & software ) Smart Phone mfr. operation ( factories ) in India, using only fellow IITans to ensure success.

But even the Sci. / Tech Ministries in India are run by greedy IAS crooks and after using our proposal as excuse to visit the US several times they blocked it - even though UPA II ( Minister Kapil Sibal ) had already allocated $1.5 billion for it.

手机发明于1973年，直到2000年，全球业务一直由摩托罗拉主导，摩托罗拉原本是一家美国公司，但从2012年起，并入了中国联想的旗下（联想最初是IBM的笔记本电脑品牌）。

作为美国摩托罗拉许多此类技术的发明者，早在2004年，然后在2012年（在前总统卡拉姆提出要求后），我就向印度电子部提出在印度建造一个完整的（包括硬件、制造和软件的研发）智能手机制造工厂，只雇佣印度理工毕业生来确保成功。

但印度的科技部由贪婪之徒把控，利用我们的提议为借口多次访问美国，后又阻止了这一提议——尽管UPA II（部长卡皮尔·西巴尔）已经为此拨款15亿美元。

At that time ( 2012–13 ) the Chinese had n't designed or built any Smart Phones of their own. Most of the Chinese handset companies were started since then by ambitious Engineers who had worked for the China branch of Motorola when it still used to be a US Co. The Govt. of China financed them.

Govt. subsidies, low labor cost ( assembly labor is plentiful and cheap in China, even a Chinese Engineer earns only about 1/5 of an US Engineer ), good infrastructure, robust and agile supply chains, cost control by volume buying, low markup ( for Apple it is 300%, for the Chinese brands it is just 20 % ) are what makes Chinese phones good enough and affordable for a cost conscious and still mentally colonized / incompetent country like India.

The main competitive edge that China has over India is in the quality of people in their respective Govt.s For the last 30 years China has been run by Engineers, all their Presidents including Xi today are trained Engineers. In contrast India with its fraudulent and incompetent democracy has been run by corrupt dynasties or virtually illiterate rabble rousers, all aided and abetted by the non technical IAS bureaucrats who are arrogant ( take on the airs of British Colonial Administrators ) and greedy, use their Mafia like control of the Govt. to feather their own nests.

当时（2012-13年），中国人还没有设计或制造出自己的智能手机。后来大多数中国手机公司都是由曾在摩托罗拉中国分公司工作过的雄心勃勃的工程师创办的，当时摩托罗拉还是一家美国公司。中国为他们提供了资金。

政府补贴、低廉的劳动力成本（在中国组装手机，劳动力充足且廉价，即便是中国工程师的工资也只有美国工程师的1/5）、良好的基础设施、强健灵活的供应链、通过批量购买来控制成本、较低的利润（对苹果来说是300%，对中国品牌来说只有20%）是中国手机对于像印度这样一个有成本意识但仍处于精神殖民/无能状态的国家来说是可以负担得起的。

中国相对印度的主要竞争优势在于两国政府的人员素质。过去30年来，中国一直由工程师领导，历任主席都是受过培训的工程师。与之形成鲜明对比的是，印度的制度是由腐败的王朝或几乎不识字的煽动者管理的，这些人得到了那些傲慢（摆出英国殖民管理者的架子）和贪婪的官僚的帮助和怂恿，利用他们对政府的黑手党般的控制来中饱私囊。

Had the IAS scoundrels not blocked our plans, today India will not have to import nearly $50 billion worth of Electronics from its enemy China and might even be exporting some to them.

Of course India has yet another handicap compared to China.and that is its traditional crooked Banias ( traders ). Even the largest of these Traders ( like the Ambanis ) do not wanta to get into high capital, high risk enterprises like manufacturing prefer importing from China instead. Pseudo Indian Smart Phone brands like Micro Max are just rebranded Chinese products. These traders control the current Govt. and have distorted their decision making.

There is really no hope for India so long as it is run by fools and crooks. FYI the avg. IQ of Indians is just 83 ( even lower for Hindi speakers of the BIMARU states ), that for the US 100 and for the Mainland Chinese 103.

But the avg. IQ for IIT ans in Silicon Valley is as high as 115. Too bad that the JEALOUS IDIOTS in India will never let us help India directly, instead heap guilt on us ( "we educated you at public expense and then you abandoned the country to get rich") to beg for handouts !

如果官僚无赖们不阻止我们的计划，今天印度就无需从中国进口价值近500亿美元的电子产品，甚至还可能向他们出口一些。

当然，相比之下，印度还有另一个障碍，就是传统的欺诈行为（商人）。就连最大的贸易商（如安巴尼）也不想进入如制造业这样高资本、高风险的企业，宁愿从中国进口。像Micro Max这样的伪印度智能手机品牌只是把中国商品改了个名而已。这些商人控制着现在的政府，左右了他们的决策。

只要继续由傻瓜和骗子统治，印度就真的没有希望。仅供参考，印度人的平均智商只有83（比马鲁邦说印地语的人智商更低），而美国人100，中国大陆人103。

但硅谷印度理工毕业生们的平均智商高达115。可惜的是，印度那些嫉妒的白痴永远不会让我们直接帮助印度，而是把罪恶感堆在我们身上（“我们用公费让你们接受教育，结果你为了钱抛弃了祖国”）！

 

Dick Heuff

There are lot’s of smart Chinese people.

因为中国有很多聪明人。

 

B.T. Yang, Born in china and live in Taiwan

Yes, S. Korea can; Japan can….EVAN the US can if they are willing to work at $3/hr.

是的，韩国可以；日本可以……即便是美国也可以，如果他们愿意接受每小时3美元工资的话。

 

Bob Thornton, lives in China

It is the sheer amount of labor force and optimized supply chain that makes it difficult for any other country on the planet to compete. Add to that the work ethic, which also cannot be replicated in India or Vietnam.

正是由于劳动力的绝对数量优势和最优化的供应链，使得这个星球上的任何其他国家都难以与之匹敌。再加上中国人的职业道德，印度和越南也无法复制。

 

Yu Maynard, Yantai City (2013-present)

I dont think so friend.

Iphone,USA

Samsung,Korea

Sony,Japan

These brands can compete with China.Sony,among of the three,seems likely the most weak,but holds quite a lot distinguished techniques in camera,screen,audio and sensors,may hit the top if he want.

China’s brands have benifited mostly from Chinese huge popularion and the Reform&Openning.On my oppion,I prefer to those brands who treat the cosumers friendly and honestly.

我不这么认为朋友。

Iphone，美国

三星，韩国

索尼，日本

这些品牌都可以与中国媲美。这三个品牌中，索尼似乎最弱，但它在相机、屏幕、音频和传感器方面拥有相当多卓越的技术。

中国的品牌主要得益于中国庞大的人口、改革开放。我个人更喜欢那些对消费者友好诚实的品牌。

 

Joe Belkin, studied at Graduated

Government backing in certain industries which includes prestige segments like tech/consumer tech. This was the game plan used by Japan in the 1960’s and South Korea in the 1980’s.

Or closer to home in more covert ways in the US, the tax laws, security laws and even bankruptcy laws favor taking chances and launching new ventures so we get a lot of startups that make instant millionaires/billionaires (and thousands/millions that are never heard of and fail but we’re okay with that unlike most countries) … or more overt, the US defense budget is about $800 BILLIOn, surprise, we have companies that try and get defense contracts.

政府对某些行业进行扶持，其中包括科技/消费科技等知名领域。这是日本在60年代和韩国在80年代采取的游戏规则。

在美国，税收法、安全法，甚至破产法都更有利于冒险和建立新的企业，因此我们有很多创业公司，让我们快速成为百万富翁/亿万富翁（还有成千上万从来没有听说过、失败的企业，但与大多数国家不同，我们对此并不介意），美国的国防预算约为8000亿美元，我们居然有公司尝试并获得了国防合同。

 

Giulio Moro, Always testing new apps and configs for mobile VoIP solutions.

The biggest chunk of every manufacturing process is the human labor costs involved, so companies routinely move their facilities to countries where they can play with both widely-varying currency exchange rates and overall inexpensive labor rates and then their products are made at a fraction of their previous costs.

The next manufacturing frontier will be India as they surpass China’s population.

In the 70s-90s it was Mexico for many companies, but it turned-out to be a very bad and costly mistake.

所有制造过程中的最大头是所涉及的人力成本，因此企业通常会将其设备转移到一些国家，在这些国家，他们既可以利用极大的货币汇率差，也可以利用总体低廉的劳动力价格，因此他们的产品成本就可以大大降低。

下一个制造业前沿将是印度，因为印度人口将超过中国。

在70-90年代，对许多公司来说，墨西哥是首选，但结果却是一个非常糟糕和代价高昂的错误。

 

Jeff Gruszynski, 35 Years as an electrical engineer

The US used to dominate electronics. We abandoned and abdicated the market primarily because switching capital infrastructure to the next new things (Printed Circuit Boards) was judged “too expensive” so most American brands outsourced to Japan who was not playing on a level playing field (they got government subsidies to create an export market - US companies got nothing from the government).

Could be get that industry back? Well, it’s not the same industry it was. It will never create as many jobs as used to exist in electronics because now things are automated in part to save money but more because humans simply can’t or won’t do the jobs as well.

If we have a war with China, we won’t have a choice because currently China manufactures >90% of the world’s electronics either as an OEM or as a direct branded supplier, and that include military electronics supply chains as well: we’ll have to bring it back

美国也曾主导电子行业。我们放弃并退出这个市场，主要是因为将资本基础设施转移到了下一个新事物（印刷电路板）被认为“太贵”，所以大多数美国品牌外包给日本，而日本并未进行公平竞争（他们得到政府补贴，打造出口市场——美国公司没能从政府部门获得一分一毫）。

能让这个行业恢复吗？嗯，现在和以前不一样了。它不可能创造出像以前电子工业中那样多的工作岗位，因为现在为了省钱，都采取了自动化，而且现在的人根本不可能或不会再做同样的工作了。

如果我们与中国开战，我们别无选择，因为目前中国生产的电子产品占到全世界电子产品的90%以上，要么是原始设备制造商，要么是直接品牌供应商，其中也包括军用电子产品供应链：我们必须夺回这一切。

 

Richard Johnson

Because consumers buy the product that is the least cost and does the job they want done. China is a slave state manufacturer (IMHO). That way they can drive down the cost of anything they produce. So, companies that produce items like electronics and actually almost everything can have Chinese corporation make their products cheaply, then bring them to a non slave labor country and out price locally made items. Because the consumer is isolated from the manufacturing, they choose the least cost items. Countries should be taxing imports from slave labor countries, but don’t, as the consumer likes the lower costs and likely the politicians are bought off by corporations that are profiting by the slave labor.

因为消费者选择购买价格最低的产品。这样他们能降低任何商品的生产成本。所以，生产电子产品和几乎所有产品的公司都可以让中国公司廉价地生产产品，然后把它们送到一个没有奴隶劳动力的国家，在那里出售。因为消费者与不了解制造业，所以他们会选择价格最低的产品。各国应该对从奴工国家进口的商品征税，但没有，因为消费者喜欢低价商品，而政客们很可能被靠奴工获利的公司收买了。

 

Roberto Santocho, Working with manufacturers in China since the 1980s

Q: Why can't other countries compete with China in the electronic and smartphone market?

A: It’s actually very simple. China has extremely low cost wages, which The West has enjoyed for decades. Thats is it. All the other fancy explanations, of complex macro economic systems are simply unnecessarily complex ways of saying this.

Q： 为什么其他国家不能在电子和智能手机市场与中国竞争？

A： 其实很简单。中国的人工成本极低，西方已经享受了几十年。原因就是这样。对于复杂的宏观经济体系，所有其他花哨的解释都是不必要的复杂说法。