【下】为何中国要比其他所有国家都要高效？ [美国媒体]

Why is the Chinese government so much more effective than any other government?

【下】为何中国要比其他所有国家都要高效？





Ray Comeau, A decade in China, interest in geopoliticsAnswered Jul 12, 2017A2AAs a ruling organization, the Chinese government has been effective in a number of areas in recent decades; however not all areas have achieved the same level of success to date.
Area’s like the environment, air pollution etc, achievements has been less spectacular compared to economical ones etc.Over time, China’s governance evolved into a system based on long term planning, target setting, measurement and achievement. In other words, movement of people up the pyramid to the more important roles of administrating the country is done based on meritocracy. This creates technocrats rather then politicians.
Another advantage is having a one party system, that a government unite behind, despite internal competition for individuals continues to exists, and long term goals are possible.
Multi-party systems:Openly confrontationalSeeks to undermine government initiativesParty success is priority, not national bettermentFocuses on short term results
Ray Comeau

作为一个执政组织，中国zf在诸多领域里高效运作已有数十年了；当然，至今并不是所有领域都保持着这样的效率。
某些领域如：环境、空气污染等，这些领域所达成的目标远没有经济上的成就喜人。

假以时日，中国的治理发展成为一个以长期规划、目标设定、衡量和成就为基础的体系。换句话说，人们成为以建立在精英统治的基础上的、在管理国家方面扮演更重要的角色。这就产生了技术官僚，而不是政治家。（译注：此处逻辑比较乱，不必过分解读。）
另一大优势在于一党执政，zf团结一致，尽管也存在内部竞争，但也有长期的目标。

多党政治：
公开的对抗
试图破坏zf的行动
政党的成功是优先考虑的，而非改善国家
关注短期结果

Randall Burns, Graduate Certificate Software Engineering, Carnegie Mellon University (2006)upxed Jun 17, 2017
I think you first need to be clear just what the accomplishments of the CPC have been so far
a) they reverse a decline of over 150 years china had gone through.
b) they are about 80–90% of the way to restoring China’s former position in the world economy.
c) they have developed a working strategy for integration into a modern global economy
A lot of that former position involved some very traditional aspects of Chinese culture: respect for authority, respect for education/learning, meritocracy. Some of Mao’s big gambles failed. The CPC has had a lot of success by just focusing on basics in a careful, controlled fashion.
The Chinese government has made improvement on corruption, but there is still a lot of work to be done. One of the great strengths of the Chinese government is the meritocratic tradition deeply rooted in Chinese culture.
I think China may have some big wins ahead related to use of Big Data.
Beijing thinking big on switch to a big data economy
The Planning Machine
and their recent automation initiatives:
World Robotics Report 2016
Both of those are made much easier by the meritocratic and technocratic aspects of the Chinese government. A collection of substance-impaired attorneys that spend most of their time raising funds from oligarchs(which is a sadly accurate descxtion of the US congress) have a lot more trouble in these kinds of areas.
Randall Burns 

我觉得你首先需要先明确CCP至今有都有哪些成就。
1.他们扭转了中国已经持续了150年的衰落；
2.他们在恢复中国曾经在世界经济中的位置，已经完成了80-90%了；
3.他们已经制定了一个融入现代全球经济的工作策略；

中国过去的位置涉及到一些中国文化中非常传统的层面：尊重权威，尊重教育/学习，精英统治。毛的一些巨大赌博失败了。如今CCP小心翼翼的专注于基础并已经取得了巨大的成功。
中国zf在腐败方面已经改善了，但依然有大量的工作要去做。中国zf最强大的力量之一就在于，精英统治深植于中国文化之中。

我觉得中国可能在大数据方面已经取决了一些巨大的成功。
《中国政府在转向大数据经济方面很有想法》
《策划机》
以及他们的自动化项目：
《世界机器人报告2016》

这些事物，对于以精英和技术专家主导的中国zf而言不要太容易。
而一群从寡头那里筹集资金的代理人（这是对美国国会的准确描述）在这类领域则会有更多的障碍。这些律师的大部分时间都花在了从寡头那里筹集资金（这是对美国国会的准确描述）。

Vladislav Antonov, Former Military Officer/revolutionary/immigrantAnswered Jun 9, 2017
Because it’s one of the most technocratic governments in modern society. So, what do I mean by that?
Let’s look at the US. Almost every single politician and decision maker in the US is lawyer.
But majority of Chinese politicians, in order to climb high, start from the bottom. Some of them start from governing position in village, then in town, city, area, province, etc. So those people have idea about every single step of the whole mechanism.In many European and Western countries, things like Secretary of Defense and Head of Police are political positions, rather than professional. US department of education is leaded by person who has never worked in educational field. Under Obama Administration, Secretary of Defense was Ash Carter - physicist.
During Obama Administration, Sylvia Mathews Burwell was a secretary of Health and Human Services. She worked 0 days in medical field.
To compare, Chinese minister of Health is Chen Zhu, who is molecular biologist and hematologist.
Also, unlike western society thinks, those ministers are checked by other members of party and committees, who consist of professionals. So it’s not like Minister by himself is professional and the rest are politicians. No, he is responsible in front of other professionals. I won’t go in details because I am not an expert in Chinese governmental structure (I just know the basic structure), so you would have to ask Chinese person more in details. Don’t want to spread some false information.
But you got the concept.
Vladislav Antonov

因为它是现代社会中最具技术官僚主义的政府之一。这是什么意思呢？
让我们看看美国。在美国，几乎每一个政客和决策者都是律师。
但大多数中国政客们为了爬得高，得从底层做起。他们中的一些人从乡村的管理开始，然后是城镇，城市，区域，省，等等，所以这些人对整个机制的每一步都有自己的想法。

在许多欧洲和西方国家里，像国防部长和警察总长之类的都是政治性职位而非技术性职位。美国教育部门由一个从来没有在教育领域工作过的人来领导。在奥巴马治下，国防部长是Ash Carter，他是物理学家。
在奥马巴治下期间，中国的卫生部长是陈竺，她是分子生物学家和血液学家。

还有，不像西方社会所想的那样，这些（中国的）部长都是通过政党或由专业人员所组成的委员会选出来的。所以，并不是那种部长自己是专业人员而余下人都是政客。我不会对此做过多详述，毕竟我也不是中国政治体系的专家（我只知道一些基础的体系），所以你必须去问一问中国人来了解更多细节。别想着传播一些虚假的信息。

Daniel WongJun 9, 2017 · 18 upvotes
I agree with your comment about China appointing people who come up from the bottom. But your choice criticizing the Obama’s administration’s appointments is not accurate. Take Ash Carter for example. No doubt he was a physicist but only for a span of about 4 years from 1984 to 88 and from 1988 on wards, he did a lot of work in international and defense related affairs at an international level. In 1993, he was appointed Asst Sec of Defense to the Clinton administration. So not a soldier but a person with very good credentials in international affairs especially the military aspect of it.

关于中国从基层任命职位这点我同意你的说法。
但你批评奥巴马zf的任命是不对的。就拿Ash Carter来举例。毫无疑问他确实是物理学家，但其在1984-1988有过4年的任期，这期间他在国际和国防相关事务上做了大量工作，具有国际水平。
1993年，他被任命为克林顿zf的国防助理。
所以尽管不是一个士兵，但也是一个在国际事务中有很好的资历的人，尤其是军事方面。

Vladislav AntonovJun 9, 2017 · 28 upvotes
In order to understand military, you have to go through military service, not just military commities. The difference is huge. About the same as between being surgeon and driver in hospital

为了理解军队，你必须要服兵役，而非只是进入军事社区。它们的差别是巨大的。这就像是医院里，一个是外科医生一个只是司机。

Wei ShiOct 28 · 2 upvotes
It is more like surgen & public relation consultant for the hospital.

这更像是一个是医院里的外科医生、一个是医院里的公关顾问。

Tejas Ramakrishnan, Research Engineer, Entrepreneur, Avid ReaderAnswered Jun 15, 2017
Questions like these make me dislike Quora. You should always vet your assumption because asking the reason for it.
“Why do you think the Chinese government is so much more effective than any other government? “
You should have asked:
“Is the Chinese government more effective than other governments? Why?”
Now I will answer the second question since the first doesn't make sense to me.
No. The Chinese government is not more effective than all other governments, and is worse than some countries on some metrics.Human rightsFreedom of pressrelationsPollutionSustainable growth
If you want examples I can give many for each. Size of economy and population makes it difficult to compare countries with each other, but some of the above points are quite easy to measure and easy to score as well. More importantly, these points are very important on their own accord.
But I will agree that the Chinese government is among the top 10%. There is a long way to go. What they do best is have a strong understanding of the pulse on most of its people, as well as an ability to make corrections quickly. That comes from a small autocracy, I guess. Overall, the Chinese people got a reasonable deal with the Communist government, which unlike other communist regimes are not a failure by any measure of the word. But there is a lot left to wish for.
Tejas Ramakrishnan

这类问题让我不喜欢Quora。人们需要开提问之前先审视一下自己的假设。
“为何你会认为中国zf比其他所有zf都要高效得多？”
你需要问的是：
“中国zf比其他所有zf都更高效，真的？为什么？”

我只回答第二个问题，因为第一个问题对我来说毫无意义。
不。中国zf并不比其他zf更有效率，在某种程度上，比其他一些国家还要糟糕一些。

任泉
对兹有的压迫
外交关系
污染
可持续增长

如果你想要例子，每一点我都可以提供很多。基于经济和人口，要相互比较有点困难，但以上这几点要测量很容易、要得出分数也很容易。更重要的是，这几点对于他们自己的记录而言非常的重要。

但我也同意的是，中国zf是排世界前10%的顶尖zf。它还有很长的路要走。他们做得最好的是对于自己绝大多数人民的需求有充分的理解，也有足够的能力来迅速纠正错误。这源于一个小型独裁政权，我猜测。
总的来说，中国人民与共产党政府达成了一项合理的协议，与其他Communist政权不同的是，ccp政府并不是一个失败的国家。但还有很多事情要做。

Robin Matthews, works at Shearman & SterlingAnswered Jun 12, 2017question begging question.
I do not agree that the current chinese government is some amazing group of genius administrators. they have had a good 30 years - taking the country from african levels of economic wealth to bulgarian levels.
they the government have made lots of mistakes on the way but the hard work and ambition of the chinese people, the investment from Japan and the West, the technology from Japan and the West, the building of key infrastructure by migrant workers fueled by cheap loans from SOE banks - all have fuelled an amazing economic recovery.
BUT The next stage is harder. And growth keeps slowing.
And beyond the economy they have big challenges which they do not really want to face up to.
environment
china has some of the worst pollution in the world. some of the worst soil pollution in the world which means that even if you drink bottled water in china then the rice you eat contains plenty of heavy metals. and the pork and chicken you eat - well they fed on grains and cereals which were grown on that soil…
the chinese government now admits that there is an air pollution issue and is taking measures to fix it but the soil pollution issue - as with the air pollution issue - is to pretend it does not exist and suppress it.
traffic
you sit in traffic for hours and you wonder why neither shanghai nor beijing passes measures to actually fix the problem. actually in some ways the chinese government is quite weak. if they actually took effective measures to fix the problem such as a ramp up in parking charges or to bring in congestion charges (as in LN) that would create losers and these losers might protest and that is dangerous for a government system as brittle as the chinese system. so ineffective measures are taken and you sit in traffic for hours.
human rights
right - you don’t have any. that’s an effective strategy for the government now as it makes the government powerful as against you the individual chinese citizen. but it is storing up trouble for the future. the only way for chinese citizens to assert rights is to topple the system.
economic success
you don’t need to be a genius technocrat to create economic growth in a nation of 1,3 billion hard working people ready to work in MNC factories and offices or to work in SOEs which have borrowed western technology and methods. it’s been 30 years of catch-up growth.
now however it’s a new challenge - the chinese government is going to have to come up with policies which propel the chinese economy forward. Growth is slowing to 6% per annum but GDP per capita is a long way short of western levels. Around USD8K per head in China compared to USD56k in the states. I forecast China in its current state will get to around USD15K in the next ten years but by then GDP growth will have slowed to developed world levels. but china will not be developed - or rather it will be patchily developed - a number of big cities which have achieved western levels of affluence and then the great ocean of China more like Bulgaria than New York - but a very polluted Bulgaria. And in a China like that what future does the Chinese communist party have?
what holds China back economically? the education system - no universities in china are in the top 20 of global universities (times rankings) - and from my experience of working with even very bright chinese students at Peking U there is a culture of rehashing existing work rather than creating any kind of original ideas or thoughts or backing a point of view. everything in the chinese system has taught them that that is a bad idea.
the school system in china is an intensely national and narrow approach to education. lots of rote learning. lots of correct answers. sure the chinese do well on literacy and numeracy (which has helped to propel that existing economic miracle) but in order to move to the next level they require to develop critical thinkers with initiative and creativity. But that is not what the chinese education system is about and for obvious reasons the Party does not really want that.
the law. most wealthy chinese are always looking for ways to get their money out of china. because they have no sense that the Chinese government is committed to protecting their wealth. get on the wrong side of an anti-corruption campaign and not only could your wealth go - you might be in prison!
bad habits. the lesson the chinese ruling class have learned from the last 30 years is that you borrow money (from SOE banks) and you build stuff - bridges / railways / roads / malls / offices and as the economy explodes and grows the loans are effortlessly repaid or more likely rolled over. but china is now up to its neck in debt so that road to growth is no longer available.
Robin Matthews

我不同意当前的中国zf是某种一意义上的不可思议的天才zf。他们只是良好治理了30年，把这个国家从非洲水平的经济提升到了保加利亚的水平而已。
这个zf在发展之路上犯了很多的错误，但努力工作和充满抱负的中国人、来自日本和西方的投资、来自日本和西方的科学技术、通过来自国有银行廉价贷款推动的、农民工修建的关键基础设施建设，所有这些都刺激了不可思议的经济复苏。
但经济之外，他们还有没有真正想过要面对的、巨大的挑战。

环境。
中国是世界污染最严重的国家之一。是土壤污染最严重的国家之一，这意味着即便你在中国喝一杯水、吃一碗米饭都包含了大量重金属。而你所吃的猪肉和鸡肉，都是用在这些污染的土地上种植出来的谷物来喂养的。
中国zf承认有空气污染问题并正在采取措施来解决它，但土地污染问题相比于空气污染，）（zf）就假装不存在了并把它压了下来。

交通
你在路上要花好几个小时，你好奇为什么上海和北京都没有通过措施来解决这个问题。
实际上，在某些方面，中国政府相当薄弱。如果它们真的采取了有效的措施来解决这个问题，比如停车收费的增加，或者引入拥堵费，就会有人受损，而这些失败者可能会抗议，这对一个像中国体制这样脆弱的政府体系来说是危险的。所以采取了无效的措施，于是你在路上要花好几个小时。

任泉
权利，你半点都没有。这对政府来说是一种有效的策略，因为它让政府对你的个人有了强大的影响力。但它为未来埋下了隐患。中国公民维护权利的唯一途径就是推翻这个制度。

经济成功
在一个拥有13亿辛勤工作的人的国家里创造经济增长，你不需要成为一个天才的技术专家（就能做到），他们可以在跨国公司的工厂和办公室工作，或者在已经借鉴了西方技术和方法的国有企业工作。这是长达30年的追赶增长。

然而，现在有了一个新的挑战——中国zf将不得不拿出推动中国经济向前发展的政策。中国经济增速放缓至6%，但人均GDP仍远低于西方水平。相比于美国人均5万6000美元的GDP，中国人均GDP不过8000美元。我预测中国接下来10年会达到1万5左右，但那时候的GDP增长将放缓至发达国家水平。但那时的中国还不是发达国家，或者更准确的说将会是非正规的发达国家：大量大城市已经达到西方水平但污染会非常的严重。但这样的中国，CCP还能有什么未来呢？

是什么让中国的经济倒退的呢？教育制度：没有一所大学进入了全球前20名，基于我的工作经验，即便是北京大学那些聪明的中国学生，也存在一种对已存在的事物进行改进的文化，而非创造任何一个新的点子/想法/观点。在中国的教育体制之中，这被教育为是糟糕的想法。

中国学校制度带有强烈的、狭隘的民族主义。大量机械式学习。大量正确的答案。自然，中国人在读写和计算能力上表现良好（这也有助于推动现有经济的奇迹）。但为了上升到下一阶段，他们需要发展出自发的、创造性的批判性思维。但中国的教育制度并不具备这些，而且明显的原因是，政党并不真正想要实现这点。

法律
大多数富有的中国人总是寻求把钱从中国拿出来的方法。因为他们没有感觉到中国zf有致力于保护他们的财富。在反腐运动中站错队，你的财富不仅会消失——你可能还会被关进监狱！

糟糕的习惯
中国统治阶级从过去30年里学到的教训就是从你手中借钱（从国有企业），然后你去搞建设：桥梁、铁路、道路、商城、办公楼，之后就是经济爆炸，贷款可以被轻易偿还，亦或者，贷款继续利滚利。但中国现在已经被债务卡了脖子，所以这条通往增长的道路已经不复存在了。