美国封锁华为而大家却认为中国不可封锁谷歌 [美国媒体]

Why is it OK for the US to block Huawei but not OK forChina to block Google?

为什么美国政府封锁华为，但是大家却觉得中国封锁谷歌不行？

谷歌：



华为：





第一个回答：

James Wang, Chinese
As an ex-huaweier, we allknow why the US block Huawei. Because Huawei is too mysterious, it is a giantbut not listed in wall street. CEO de facto has military background.

JamesWang, 中国人：
作为一个曾经在华为工作的人，我们都知道为什么美国封锁华为。因为华为太神秘了，它非常巨大但是没有在华尔街上市。华为CEO有军方背景。

Huawei really wants thatbig cake in North America, even providing free facilities, hiring ex-governoras advisor, building development center in Silicon Valley.

华为真的想要北美的那份巨大的蛋糕，甚至为了达到这个目的提供了很多免费的设备，雇佣了很多前政府官员做说客，在硅谷建立研发中心。

"Try so hard, go so far,in the end..."
That is all because ofthe politic.

“我尝试了如此艰苦和它迄今为止,但最终..”（林肯公园歌词）
都是政治的原因。

As a Google fan, I thinkthe Chinese government will continue to block Google and its services. It ispretty awkward if Chinese leaders can find scandals of themselves in Googlesearch results. By contrast, Baidu, the competitor in China, knows how tobalance the money and the moral.

作为一个google的粉丝，我想中国政府会继续封锁google和它的服务。事实上如果中国领导人能够在google的搜索结果里面看到他们的丑闻会让他们非常尴尬。与之相比，谷歌在中国的竞争者知道怎么去平衡金钱与道德。

If Quora supports content input in Chinese, Iam pretty sure, Quora will be blocked as well. You need a VPN in China,seriously.

如果Quora支持中文问题我很确定Quora也会被封锁。你在中国真的需要一个VPN。

2016/03/02 update:
Thanks to Sam Stromyer'scomment. Actually, my answer does not fit the question. I guess the questionmaker might be a Chinese speaker and the question can be described in this way,
"Since US blocksHuawei, China can block Google as a revenge. However, few people thinks Chinashould do that."

2016/03/02 更新：
感谢Sam Stromyer的评论。实际上我的回答并不切题。我想如果提问者是一个中国人的话问题可能会是这样：“因为美国封锁了华为，所以中国可以封锁google作为报复手段。不过很少人认为中国应该这样做。”

I will make the point whyit is not OK for China to block Google. To make it short, there is nolegislation in China pointing out that Google is providing illegal services.There is no standard you can follow. They are obscure and subtle. Governmentsusually just give a call to tell you XXX cannot be shown today. Tomorrow, theymight give another blacklist, day in day out. At first, when Kai-Fu Lee was incharge of Google China, it worked fine. Google China could follow the cadence.For more details please refer to book "How Google Works: EricSchmidt, Jonathan Rosenberg: 9781455582341: Amazon.com: Books".

我会论证为什么中国不能封锁google这个观点。简而言之，中国没有法律能够指出google提供了非法服务，没有任何标准可以遵循。它们（法规）是模棱两可的。政府经常告诉你XXX不能在今天出现。明天他们可能会提供另一个黑名单，日复一日。一开始李开复在谷歌中国的时候，还算正常。谷歌中国能跟上节奏。更多信息可以查阅这本书book"How Google Works: EricSchmidt, Jonathan Rosenberg: 9781455582341: Amazon.com: Books"

It is true and allChinese know it is happening everyday. It is also the reason why it is hard forbig names in Silicon Valley to make business in China. (Zuckerberg,please learn Zen after Chinese courses or hire one who can do it.)

这都是中国每天发生的事实，同时也是硅谷很难与中国做生意的原因（Zuckerberg（facebook总裁），请到中国课程里面学禅的思想或者雇佣一个会的人）

I do not think thegovernment can publish the list of the words you cannot search. Take TankManfor instance, it is connected to what happened in 1989 in Tiananmen square.Obviously, it is not a sexy image but it does hurt some eld guys in Beijing.
Since you cannot tell mewhich one is not correct, you cannot say I am wrong.

我觉得政府不会公布你不能搜索的文字的名单。例如“坦克人”，跟1989年广场事件有关。显然这些不是色情图片，但是这伤害了在北京某些老头的感情。因为我说的都是事实，所以你没办法说我错的。

 

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对这一个评论的评论：

Michael Shanahan 5 votes
Show
Umm, NO. Let me tell you a story..... that happens to be true.Tyco owns a division called TE. They work in the submarine cabling industry andwanted to give their customers a more complete line of product. So Huawei wascontacted as well as a few other companies that manufacture SDH (SynchronousDigital Hierarchy) equipment and asked to build a system based off the TycoSLTE (Submarine Line Terminal Equipment). Huawei told Tyco to send over theSLTE and they would manufacture an SDH based off of their equipment. So Tycodid....... Huawei proposed an SDH system based on and identical to a olderEricsson SDH. Two years later Huawei is now in the SLTE game..... their SLTE isidentical to the Tyco SLTE, a different color and the name Huawei, butotherwise identical. The reason the US has banned them is because they reverseengineer other companies equipment and market it off as their own.

哦不，让我告诉你一个故事，真实发生的。美国泰科有一个部门叫TE。他们从事海底光缆工业并希望为他们的客户提供一条龙服务。但是华为同时接触了其他也制造SDH (同步数字系列)装备的公司并且要求其用美国泰科的Tyco SLTE (海底光缆设备)建造一个系统。华为告诉美国泰科寄来SLTE，他们会在他们系统中全部都用美国泰科的设备。所以美国泰科寄了..但是华为弄出了一个用爱立信设备的的老SDH系统。两年后华为进军SLTE，他们的设备和美国泰科SLTE相似，就是颜色不同logo换成华为，但是其他完全都一样。这就是美国封锁他们的原因，他们逆向其他公司的设备抢占他们的市场。

Alex Yang 3 votes Show
It's an exception and I'm curious about that Quora is inthe whitelist.

我很好奇并意外为什么Quora没被封锁。

Harry Eaton 2 votes Show
I think the answer is obvious. Installing Huawei carrier-class routers into any countries strategicbackbone network lays the network open to embedded code that might be used tosecretly leech information.  Having saidthat the US have a long history of xenophobic paranoia.  So it’s probably a mixture of both.
The Chinese administration don’t care much for free circulationof information.  Having said that, destabilizinga restrictive regime in the name of democracy is not necessarily in theinterest of the majority of the population as the current chaos in the MiddleEast clearly demonstrates.

我想答案是显而易见的。安装华为的电信级路由器到任何国家的战略网络中，设备里面的隐藏代码会让网络暴露并泄密。不得不说美国有很长一段时间的偏执型恐外、所以这两种原因都有。
中国政府不关心信息自由。不得不说以民主的名义限制发展的引擎不符合大部分人的意义，就像中东现在混乱的现状一样。

Ivan Lin 2 votes Show
aha.you are right.但是我们还有''知乎''

哦，你是对的。但是我们还有''知乎''

Greg Zaha 1 vote by Anton Lakhin
Because Western hypocrisy - there's a long-standing tradition ofit

因为长期存在的西方伪善主义。

Sam Stromyer
The question asks 'why is it OK?' - there is no single higherbeing determining what is OK and what isn't - every entity acts differently andaccording to the rules/laws of the arena in which it operates.

问题问的是为什么合理。没有任何高票答案讨论了哪些合理哪些不合理，没个实体都不同，都应该按照当地的法律执行。

Wenliang Li
i haven't use vpn but i can use quora.

（译者：貌似国人）我没用VPN但是我能用quora

Will Wang
you may unware that Google services like translate, Ad,Map etcare not block in china

（译者：貌似也是国人）你可以感受到到google某些服务比如翻译，广告等在中国没被封锁

Samuel Liu
Quora is blocked in Shanghai.

Quora在上海被封锁了。

James Wang
No way. I can login in Nanjing.

（答上一层）没有，我在南京能登陆。

ChinaStronk
First of all, Huawei devices except radio-devices are widelysold in U.S, which means they already have a big cake in the market and you'rewrong.You can search it.
Secondly, it is not just mysterious. Engineer's in U.S are notstupid, and many of them has chinese background which means they know bettersource than yours. They checked your illegal devices, and found out that it hasa serious problem The Voter's Self Defense System
Thirdly, Google cannot touch any radio network other thaninternet cache.
All in all, no one will buy your opinion seriously.

首先，华为的设备除了无线之外都在美国大量销售，这意味着它已经分到了很大一块蛋糕，所以你是错的，你能搜索到这个。
另外，华为不仅仅是神秘。美国的工程师不蠢，他们大部分都有中国背景，所以这意味着他们有比你更好的消息源。他们检查了你们的非法设备，发现自保护系统有很多严重的问题。
第三，google除了网络缓存不会接入其他无线网络。
总之，没人会认同你的观点。

 

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第二个回答：

Jason Chen, earliest web users in China, now ininternet industry as consultant
1.3k Views  Jason is a Most Viewed Writer in Internet in China.
Ithink this question is some kind similar to Why Is It Ok for Human Beings toEat Food but not Ok for Them to Eat Shit Like Dog.

Jason Chen，早期中国互联网用户，现在从事互联网行业。

JamesWang as an ex-employee of Huawei mentioned Huawei being a mysterious companywith the boss having military background. This is not a rumor, you can findmany reports both in English and Chinese. As for Huawei's mystery, even mostChinese don't know its shareholding structure and the secret of its fastdevelopment. But if you have better understanding of Chinese politics ,business and culture, you should have known Huawei,starting from a tiny privateenterprise as it claimed in the most heavily monopolizedindustry(telecommunication) to be a behemoth in less than 3 decades,without the government's support, it would be impossible. As for whatgovernment's supports are, there are still more need us to dig.

JamesWang（第一个回答的答主）作为一个前华为员工提到了华为是一个迷一样的公司并且老大有军方背景。这不是一个谣言，你可以找到很多中文的英文的报道。华为的神秘甚至很多中国人都不知道它的股权结构和它快速发展的密码。不过如果你有更好的对中国政治，商业和文华的理解，你应该能知道华为，30年内从小的私营企业到垄断企业（电信）没有政府支持这是不可能的。政府支持为了什么，我们还可以挖掘更多。

TheUS government blocked Huawei's certain M&A activities in the US because itthought when compared with other foreign companies, Huawei's opaqueshareholding structure would result in potential risks as most of them wererelated to the strategic telecommunication industry and it was alleged to haveespionage practices in the past. Before Huawei carried out its M&A, the CIFUS'scriteria was in place , clear and rational, it should have known it might facecertain obstacles. And the review from the US government did not go beyond theexisting laws either.

美国政府封锁华为和并购活动是因为它认为相对其他外国企业，华为不透明的股权结构会引发潜在的风险，并且是在战略的电信产业下的，并且华为曾经被指控从事间谍活动。在华为提出它的并购计划之前，美国的外国投资委员会(CFIUS)提出必须要华为透明。同时美国政府的行为并没有违反美国法律。

Nowlet us talk about the CCP's blocking Google. In Jason Chen's answer to Why does the Chinese government block Gmail? I gave most reasons, and you can find more details in Steven Levy's excellentwork.  The biggest problem with the CCP is not its having a widecersorship, but this censorship system never being clear and open to theoutside world, which is always at its discretion. There is no way the foreigncompany would ever know where the redline is , even  Chinese companies arethe victims of this opaque and black box operation. When the CCP blockedGoogle's operation in China, it just claimed Google had violated Chinese laws, butdid and could it tell you which law Google had violated? Never!
Soone is eating food, the other is eating shit, can't you tell the difference?

现在我们来讨论中国封锁谷歌。在Jason Chen's answer to Why does the Chinese government block Gmail?这个问题中我给出了许多原因，你也可以在Steven Levy的回答中找到更多的细节。中国的一大问题是大范围的审查，但是这个审查系统对外界又不透明，只考虑他自身的利益。其他国家的公司没办法知道红线到底在哪，甚至中国自己的企业也被这些不透明的黑盒操作伤害到了。中国封锁google在中国的活动，声称其违反了中国的法律，但是他会告诉你违反了那一条？也许永远不会。
所以一个人在吃食物另一个人在吃屎，你还不知道这有什么不同吗？

 

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对此答案的评论：

Tianbo-David Sun 1 vote by Samuel Liu
Zhengfei Ren is a PREMATURELY RETIRED PLA officer during the80s when Deng said "The military must endure." Many PLA personnelswere laid off at their 30s and started their own enterprises then. There's no"conspiracy" behind it nor is it a calculated PLA arrangement. It'sas common as how the baby boomers were conceived. It's just an excuse forwhatever mistrust and lobbying resulted, but like it or not, Huawei is alreadythe largest internet infrastructure provider on earth and most certainly notthe first Chinese IT company in the U.S. Check your router, check your internetcable, check your hard drive and masterboard, are they all bugged?

任正非是一个早退的解放军军官，是在80年代邓小平宣布“军队需要忍耐”的时候。许多解放军员工在30岁的时候就下岗了开启了他们自己的公司。这里面没有阴谋，或者解放军的安排。这和婴儿潮时代那些思想相同，是说客的借口而已，不管你喜不喜欢，华为是互联网基础设施最大的同上也不是第一家到美国的中国公司。看看你的路由器，你的拨号器，你的硬件和母版，他们都有窃听器？

Tianbo-David Sun
Also, although I personally hate a walled Internet, Chinesegovernment did stated very plainly that Google "failed to comply Chineselaws and regulations." Well, a walled Internet for one failed to show usthe haters out there.

另外，虽然我讨厌被墙，中国政府很明白的和google说“没有遵守中国法规”。好吧，至少墙能够挡住墙外那些讨厌我们的人。

Jim Chan
downvoted for vulgar language

差评，因为有侮辱性的言论。

 

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第三个回答：

Kevin Hahn, undergraduatemath student, society issues' thinker
6k Views
Something to say in advance. The founder of Huaweionce was an officer in military system, but there is no evidence to say thatChinese government is invested in Huawei. However, according to Snowden, it isprobably true that Google helps NSA to monitor its users.
As for the reasons for both governments to do this,it is simple: preventing the potential security issue happening.
Every country does what benefits the country.

提前说一句，华为的成立者曾经在军方系统里面工作，但是没有任何证据能证明中国政府投资了华为。然而，像斯诺登所说的，google帮助了NSA监控他们的用户。
两个政府做这些的原因很简单：防止潜在的安全问题发生
每个国家都会做对自己有益的事。

 

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第四个回答：

Minghao Dai, Chinese living in San Francisco
1.1k Views
Becausemost Chinese and visitors in China actually want to use Google but thegovernment banned it. As for Huawei, nobody in US cares about whether Huawei isin the network equipment business, so the ban does little harm to a regularcitizen.
Anotherreason is that China really has a bad reputation in the English speaking world,so anything China does is considered evil automatically.
However,national security is the reason for banning in both cases. China cannot allowGoogle to operate freely and amass users in China while having all data out ofreach by the CCP.

Minghao Dai, 中国人在旧金山
因为几乎所有中国人和访问中国的人都想用谷歌但是政府不让用。对于华为，没人在美国在意它是不是从事互联网设备产业，所以封锁对普通居民的伤害更少。
另一个原因是中国在英语国家的名声很差，所以中国做的每一件事都是自然邪恶的。
然而，国家安全都是两个案例被封锁的原因。中国不能允许谷歌能在不守中国控制的文件上允许和积累用户。

 

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第五个回答：

Dongliang Zhu, Fan of Civilization series
661 Views
It'sabout people's perception of the brand/company. Google is dominating in searchengine market and most Chinese netizens are aware of it. On the other hand,Huawei has way less influence in the western cellphone/technology marketdespite it has been grown rapidly. Imagine Huawei has the same influence levelas Apple does, it won't be that simple to ban Huawei.

Dongliang Zhu, 文明游戏爱好者
这是一个人们对品牌/公司看法的问题。谷歌支配了搜索行业，并且大部分中国人能感受到。另外，华为在西方市场上手机/科技影响力比较小，虽然也在快速增长。想象一下华为和苹果公司影响力一样的话，封锁华为就不会那么简单了。

 

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第六个回答：

Edward Logan, Graduate student in China Studies, JohnsHopkins SAIS
127 Views
Thisis a very specific situation. The US and Australia I think are the twocountries blocking Huawei now and it's not due to "the Chinese governmentbeing sketchy" or something naive like that, it's because Huawei partneredwith the Saddam Hussein government a decade ago and the US isn't a fan of that.It's a national security question, not discrimination against China.

Edward Logan, Johns Hopkins SAIS中国研究毕业生
这是一个很特殊的场景。美国和澳大利亚封锁华为的原因我认为不是因为“中国政府的监控”或者其他简单的原因,比如华为和萨达姆做了十年的贸易伙伴，美国不喜欢。这是国家安全问题，不是对中国的歧视。

 

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第七个回答：

Dave Lindbergh
1.2k Views
Itis not OK.
It'sfine with me if the US government doesn't want to buy from Huawei(or any other company).
Butit's not OK if the US government won't let private US citizens and businessesdo business with Huawei.
It'sexactly the same with Google:
It'sfine with me if the Chinese government doesn't want to buy from Google (or any other company).
Butit's not OK if the Chinese government won't let private Chinese citizens and businesses dobusiness with Google.

这不好。
如果美国政府不希望买任何华为（或其他公司）的产品这是可以接受的。
不过美国政府不让美国人民和商业和华为做生意这是不行的。
这和谷歌的情况一样：
中国政府不想用谷歌（或其他公司）的服务是可以的。
但是中国政府不让中国人用谷歌服务是不行的。