通用目前在中国的汽车销量超过了美国（上） [美国媒体]

GM now sells more cars in China than in theUS

通用目前在中国的汽车销量超过了美国（上）



（GM sells more cars inChina than in the US: that factoid from tipped me over the edge.）

（通用在中国销售的汽车比在美国销售的汽车还多：这一事实让我感到震惊。）

[–]ANewLevelOfPowah
Do you really want all the new car ownersin a country of 1.4 billion to get into nothing but gas powered cars? Chinaalready has big issues with air quality.

在一个拥有14亿人口的国家，你真的想让所有的新车主只开汽油动力汽车吗？中国的空气质量已经存在很大问题了。

[–]99RT10
I imagine the US vehicles make way more persale.
They probably do. Still, this isinteresting, because it's an indication of the new normal. For years, China'seconomy has been growing at a rate faster than that of the US and EU, and willsoon eclipse them both. It's a matter of time before the collective andindividual buying power of that market is the highest in the world.
People complain about Pax Americana and theUS imposing westernism and political influence on the world. It will beinteresting to see how those same people feel when the predominant superpoweris an authoritarian communist police state that has murdered tens of millionsof its own people. This will change the world.

我想，美国汽车每卖出一辆，就能赚得更多。
他们可能赚更多。不过，这仍然很有趣，因为这是新常态的一个迹象。多年来，中国经济的增长速度一直快于美国和欧盟，并将很快超过这两个经济体。这个市场的集体和个人购买力达到世界最高只是时间问题。
人们抱怨“美国治下的和平”和美国将西方主义和政治影响力强加于世界。



[–]Intense_introvertBMW driver that uses his turn signals/indicators 35
Exactly. It's almost akin to the commercialproperty bubble in the US. The fallout is going to have interesting effects.

完全正确。这几乎类似于美国的商业地产泡沫。破裂冲击将产生有趣的影响。

[–]rootusrootus18 Camaro SS 1LE; 14 F150 EcoBeast
As I recall, there are entire cities inChina that have been built & purchased by speculators, and there areessentially no residents aside from maintenance people. "Massive" isa good term, but I still wonder if that under-describes the scale of thebubble. When it collapses it may be one of the only good uses of the word"epic".

我记得，中国有整座城市都是投机者建造和购买的，基本上没有居民，只有维修工。“大规模”是个好词，但我仍然怀疑，这是否低估了泡沫的规模。当它崩溃时，它可能是“史诗级”这个词唯一的好用法之一。



[–]ChaosRevealed
He never said it is sustainable. He said ifyou wanted to bet on it, there's certain things you'd have to worry about,compared to betting on most other economies.

他从未说过这是可持续的。他说，如果你想押注于此，与押注于大多数其他经济体相比，你必须担心某些事情。

[–]rootusrootus18 Camaro SS 1LE; 14 F150 EcoBeast
At best they may trade the bubble pop for amuch longer deflation, but ultimately there really isn't a way to truly escapethe issue. I'm not betting any of my money on it either way, it's a hot mess.

充其量，他们可能会用泡沫破裂换取更长的通缩，但最终真的没有办法真正逃避这个问题。不管怎样，我都不会把我的钱押在这上面，这真是一团糟。

[–]constantino1Ford Escape
well... they almost certainly sell moreSUVs/Trucks in the US, so its highly probable that they do make more pervehicle on average. But I suspect they probably earn more per car if youcompare apples to apples. GM has localized most of their production in China.plus JV pays the investment for that localization, and takes half the profitsfor the trouble... lot of math to do, but Id be willing to place my bet thatanything smaller than an acadia likely earns as much, or more, than anequivalent sale in the US.

嗯……几乎可以肯定的是，它们在美国销售的suv/卡车肯定更多，因此，它们每辆车的平均产量很可能更高。但如果你进行同类对比，我怀疑他们每辆车能否赚得更多。通用汽车的大部分产品已经在中国实现了本土化。加上合资公司为本地化支付投资，并从中获得一半利润……有很多数学计算要做，但我愿意打赌，任何比阿卡迪亚更小的汽车，在美国的销量都可能与同等汽车相当，甚至更高。



[–]randomusename
GM makes much less from China than it makesfrom North America. GM has to partner with SAIC in GM-SAIC to even sell inChina.
When GM makes decisions like importing carsfrom China manufactured by GM-SAIC I have to question why they would share theNA market with their Chinese partner when they don't have to.

通用汽车从中国赚的钱远远少于从北美赚的钱。通用汽车甚至要想在中国销售汽车，就必须在通用-上汽方面与上汽合作。
当通用汽车做出从中国进口上汽通用汽车生产的汽车等决定时，我不禁要问，为什么他们会在没有必要的情况下，与中国合作伙伴分享北美市场。



[–]BloodOnTheTracks
Yup, how easily that was forgotten. Itreally was all three automakers that nearly went under. Ford actually borrowedmore money than the other two combined, as the article points out and they'restill paying on it. Interestingly, at the time, they focused on small cars toget back on track, which we now know they're shuttering small car plants.

是的，这很容易被忘记。三家汽车制造商几乎都破产了。正如文章所指出的，福特实际上借的钱比其他两家加起来还要多，而且他们还在偿还。有趣的是，在那个时候，他们把注意力集中在小型汽车上以使其回到正轨，我们现在知道他们正在关闭小型汽车工厂。

[–]dracy692011 Buick Regal, 1970 El Camino SS
They didn't pay it all back, the governmentlost money on the transaction

他们没有全部偿还，政府在交易中赔钱

[–]ProudLikeCow
They borrowed money while it was cheap andexecuted a restructuring before shit hit the fan. I'm supposed to think thatbad?

他们趁利率还很低的时候借了钱，然后在糟糕的情况发生之前进行了重组。我应该这么想?



[–]i_stay_turnt2018 Honda Accord EX
I mean, I'm as blue as it gets but I canshare that sentiment. Maybe not about China bailing GM out but I definitelywouldn't give GM another dime. I had a Pontiac then I switched to Honda. I'veseen the light and I'll never buy an American car again. Also had a Ford.
Both of my American cars can be describedthe same way: shitty interiors, horrible reliability, and poor overall quality.Like, everytime I rolled down a window it was like gambling. Sometimes mywindow would roll back up and sometimes I didn't. I replaced my window regulatorson my Pontiac 7 times before I gave up and simply never rolled down my windows.But also my air conditioning hardly worked.

我的意思是，我很沮丧，但我也有同感。也许不是关于中国援助通用汽车，但我绝对不会再给通用一毛钱。我有一辆庞蒂亚克，然后我换了本田。我看到了曙光，我再也不买美国车了。还有一辆福特。
我的两辆美国车都可以用同样的方式来描述：糟糕的内饰、糟糕的可靠性和糟糕的整体质量。就像，每次我摇下车窗就像在赌博。有时我会把车窗摇起来，有时不会。在我放弃之前，我换了7次我的庞蒂亚克车窗调节器，而且从来没有摇下过车窗。但我的空调也几乎不起作用。

[–]SvtMrRed
GM paid back their bailout debt 10 yearsago.

通用汽车10年前就偿还了救助债务。



[–]Darkfire757'18 Suburban Premier, '12 Q7, '11 Outback
B U I C K

大别克

[–]callmeWia2018Forester
I know people in China who drives Buicks.Yea, Buicks are the cars they get when they can't afford more expensive cars,but don't want to drive the Chinese-made hot garbage.

我在中国认识开别克的人。是的，别克是当他们买不起更昂贵的汽车，但又不想开中国制造的“热垃圾”时才会买的车。

[–]inku_inku
That's not what I heard.
Many people think Buick is luxury. Sure notas good or luxurious as say Mercedes but they think highly of the brand. evenmore than what Americans think. Not just some suitable option instead of achinese brand.

我听到的可不是这样。
许多人认为别克是奢侈品。当然没有奔驰那么好，也没有奔驰那么豪华，但他们对这个品牌的评价很高。比美国人想的还要多。不只是再不买中国品牌的情况下，退而求其次的选择。



[–]aelric22'13 VW GLI
They wouldn't be too surprised once youintroduce them to some hard core American Buick customers (aka: People over70).

如果你把它们介绍给一些别克的铁杆美国客户（也就是70岁以上的人），他们不会太惊讶。

[–]-jjjjjjjjjj-
Audi and MB are both huge in China. Buickmight do better there than in the US, but its still a bit player. I've spent alot of time in China in most of the major cities and rarely see Buicks. Forevery Buick I see, there are 100 German or Chinese brand cars.

奥迪和奔驰在中国都很庞大。别克在中国可能比在美国做得更好，但它仍是一个小玩家。我在中国的大部分大城市都待过很长时间，很少见到别克。我每看到一辆别克，就有100辆德国或中国品牌的汽车。

[–]bittabet
You're just using your own anecdotalevidence which is a terrible way to go about it. By actual sales figures Buickhugely outsells Audi and Mercedes in China more than double. But most of thoseBuicks are relatively cheap models like the Excelle (aka the last gen Veranowhich actually started out as the Excelle, though oddly they now also sell thecurrent Verano as the Verano in China too).
I've noticed in China that brand popularityis very regional though, having a lot to do with what the local car producer isand who they've partnered with. But if you go to Shanghai you'll see a ton ofBuick Excelles on the street since the local car company is SAIC. Only thing isthat SAIC also partners with VW and you'll honestly just see WAYYY more VWsthan Buicks.

你只是在用你自己的道听途说，这是一种很糟糕的方法。按实际销量计算，别克在中国的销量是奥迪和奔驰的两倍多。但大多数别克车都是相对便宜的车型，比如英朗（也就是上一代的维莱诺，它最初的名字是英朗，不过奇怪的是，现在在中国也以维莱诺的名字销售）。
但我注意到，在中国，品牌的受欢迎程度非常具有地域性，这与当地汽车生产商是什么以及他们与谁合作有很大关系。但如果你去上海，你会在街上看到大量别克的英朗，因为当地的汽车公司是上汽集团。唯一的问题是，上汽也与大众合作，老实说，你看到的大众比别克更多。



[–]spongebob_meth'91 Talon TSi AWD, '01 Camaro SS, '07 Colorado, '14Fiesta
And were surprised Buick isn’t so big herein the US
They're not exactly small either, Buicksare everywhere where I live and have been for the last 25 years.

我们很惊讶别克在美国销量没有这么大
别克车销量也不小，我住的地方到处都是别克车，过去25年我一直住在那里。

[–]cookingboyF80 M3/Tesla Model 3 AWD
I grew up in China and always loved carsand I’ve never ever heard of that history, I bet very few knows about that.
Tradition, history and respect for eldersand ancestors is a big deal in China.
Yeah I can guarantee you nobody takes thatinto consideration in Mainland China, at least when it comes to car shoppinglol. But if by respect for elders you mean they want to make sure the backseatshave amazing leg room so they can drive their aging parents around, then sure.
Buick simply was one of the earliestAmerican brands entering modern China (late 90s) and back then the market wasswamped by small Chinese cars or the gazillion different variants of theVolkswagen Santana, with the high end European brands that costs more than 20years the earning of an average Chinese back then.
Then here comes Buick, an American brandwith big sedans that has plush interior and soft ride, and size and soft ridewas the equivalence to “luxury” in China (and still is), with the nice trimsand colors it looked almost as nice as a Mercedes that costed multiple times asmuch, so it took the market by storm and built the reputation it has today.

我在中国长大，一直喜欢汽车，但我从未听说过这段历史，我敢打赌很少有人知道。
在中国，传统、历史以及对长辈和祖先的尊重是一件大事。
是的，我可以向你保证，在中国大陆没有人考虑到这一点，至少在买车的时候是这样的，哈哈。但如果你说的尊敬老人是指他们想确保后座有足够的空间让他们可以载着年迈的父母四处转悠，那当然。
别克是最早进入现代中国的美国汽车品牌之一（90年代末），当时，市场上充斥着中国的小型车或大众桑塔纳的千千万万个不同版本，还有售价超过当时中国人20年平均收入的高端欧洲品牌。
然后别克来了，这是一个拥有豪华内饰和柔软乘坐感的美国大型轿车品牌，在中国，尺寸和柔软乘坐感等同于“豪华”（现在也还是），而且拥有漂亮的装饰和颜色，它看起来几乎和一辆价格是它好几倍的奔驰车一样漂亮，因此，它席卷了整个市场，建立了今天的声誉。



[–]WamBamFM
Buick is made by SAIC, the company with thebest connections to the Party. Country cousins like Chery, BYD et al just can'tcompete.

别克是由上汽集团生产的，该公司与中国的关系最为密切。奇瑞、比亚迪等国产品牌无法与之竞争。

[–]BimmerJustin
Sounds like Buick is to China what Hyundaiis to America

听起来别克之于中国就像现代之于美国

[–]ten24
Great points. Buick would probably be doingbetter here in the US if it wasn’t for their styling and image... both of whichare things that are regional. I’ve heard the regal is pretty good, but I don’tknow anyone who is actually going to test drive one... because it’s a Buick. Imean, it’s clear GM knows this too, because of their “that’s not a Buick”commercial.

说得对。如果不是因为他们的造型和形象，别克在美国可能会做得更好。两者都是区域性的。我听说君威很不错，但我不知道有谁会去试驾……因为这是别克。我的意思是，很明显通用也知道这一点，因为他们的“那不是别克”广告。



[–]BimmerJustin
Buick would be just as popular in the US ifthey could shake their reputation as an old person’s car. They’re really solidcars, probably the best GM has to offer.

如果他们能撬动自己作为老爷车的名声，别克在美国也会同样受欢迎。它们是非常坚固的汽车，可能是通用汽车能提供的最好的。

[–]aethermet
This is 100% wrong.
Buicks are popular in China because of the1990s, not because of the 1910s. They were one of the first foreignmanufacturers that took advantage of the newly capitalist China when DengXiaoping opened up the economic system after the 1980s.
Nobody in China buys a Buick because SunYat-Sen had one, especially after the Cultural Revolution in the 1960s. Youwould have been executed if you thought so. (And I'm not exaggerating).
It's because for a time period (in the1990s), if you were Chinese and want to buy a luxury car that was available forsale? You bought a Buick.
(As a side note, technically stuff likeMercedes and other true luxury brands could be bought in China soon after Buickbecame available, but supply was incredibly tiny. It was also too expensive,whereas Buicks were something that about 5-10% of the car buying public couldafford. Therefore, you saw Buicks on the road decently often and it becameembedded in the public consciousness. Think of the difference in how Americanswould view a new Corvette vs a LaFerrari. Of course, this is mostly referringto the 90s/early 2000s, stuff like Mercedes/Audi are much more common in Chinanow.)

这是完全错误的。
别克在中国受欢迎是因为上世纪90年代，而不是因为上世纪10年代。上世纪80年代286开放经济体制后，它们是首批利用新资本主义中国的外国制造商之一。
在中国，没有人会因为孙中山有一辆别克而买它，尤其是在上世纪60年代之后。如果你这么想，你早就被处决了。（我并没有夸大其词）。
这是因为在一段时间内（上世纪90年代），如果你是中国人，想买一辆可供出售的豪华车，你会怎么做？你买了辆别克。
（顺便说一句，从技术上讲，在别克上市后不久，梅赛德斯和其他真正的奢侈品牌就可以在中国买到，但供应少得令人难以置信。）它也太贵了，而别克是5-10%的购车者买得起的。因此，你经常能在路上看到别克车，它已经深入人心。想想美国人对一辆新克尔维特和一辆拉菲拉里的看法。当然，这主要指的是90年代/ 21世纪初，奔驰/奥迪等品牌在中国已经非常普遍了。



[–]madmadG
If they think it’s luxury then it’s luxury.That’s the power of branding.

如果他们认为这是奢侈品，那么这就是奢侈品。这就是品牌的力量。

[–]pills_here
This is accurate from what Ive seen aswell. It might even be viewed as higher tier than Audi, which are a dime adozen in China.

这在我看来也是正确的。它甚至可能被视为比奥迪级别更高的品牌，后者在中国都烂大街了。

[–]shaneucf
Buick used be considered the governmentofficial vehicles. Also it's an American brand.

别克曾经被认为是政府的官方车型。它也是一个美国品牌。

[–]M1A3sepV32018 Honda Accord EXL 1.5T
Company bosses drive the Buick while aMercedes picks up clients at the airport....
This is from a guy I know who live in Chinafrom 2003-2016

公司老板开着一辆别克，而不是奔驰，到机场接客户……
这是我认识的一个2003-2016年住在中国的人写的



[–]KingofCraigland
It was a luxury brand there. Not sure if itstill is.

它曾是中国的一个奢侈品牌。不知道现在是否还是这样。

[–]Uptons_BJs#TeamGrabberBlue[S]
Number 1 luxury brand, sells nearly as muchas the 3 Germans combined

销量排名第一的奢侈品牌，销量几乎相当于这三个德国品牌的总和

[–]lostboyz500 Abarth - Porsche 944
It has nothing to do with luxury for the USsales, it's the perfect car for grandparents. It's small, with good groundclearance, awd, and they already have senior citizens on speed dial. If it wasactually a good car the chevy trax would be doing better than it is.

这款车在美国的销售与奢侈品无关，它是祖父母们的完美选择。它很小，有很好的地面净空，全轮驱动，而且他们已经有老年人在快速拨号。如果它真的是一辆好车，雪佛兰创酷会比它做得更好。