中国的致命要害是其教育系统，这是真的吗？ [美国媒体]

-------------译者：haleyyen-审核者：skysonssk------------

Is Forbes magazine right to say that China's Achilles heel is its education system?

据福布斯杂志说，中国的致命要害是其教育系统，这是真的吗？
-------------译者：haleyyen-审核者：skysonssk------------

Godfree Roberts Ed.D. Education & Geopolitics University of Massachusetts Amherst (1973)

戈弗雷.罗伯茨   教育学博士    马萨诸塞大学阿默斯特分校 教育和地缘政治专业（1973）

upxed May 20
My doctorate is in education and I've been visiting China since 1967 and following its educational progress with great interest. Forbes’ statement "the continuing emphasis on ideology in the humanities is China’s biggest Achilles heel. Moving up the global value chain is impossible without a dramatic overhaul of its current education system. Instead of cultivating independent minds education is first and foremost a device for enforcing Party ideology to the young and impressionable minds" is naive.

我的博士学位专业是教育，而且从1967年以来一直往来于中国，很有兴趣地关注着中国教育的进步。福布斯认为，“中国的致命要害是一直强调人文意识形态，如果不对其现行教育体系进行一次巨大变革，那在全球价值链上提升是不可能实现的。在中国，教育首先来说是重要的手段，把政党观念强加给年轻人和容易受影响的人，而不是培养独立的思想。”我认为这种想法太天真幼稚。
 
Like censorship (which 80% of Chinese approve!) ideology is a public matter publicly disclosed and publicly discussed. Their censor is called Chief Censor everyone knows his name and everyone has read his rules. American ideology is emxded in our schooling (history is ideological) TV programs and commercials and is secretly enforced by a small group of media-owners and government officials. That’s the real reason so few of us trust our media: we know we’re getting a one-sided picture but we don’t know who’s responsible for creating it.

像80%的中国人赞成的审查制度，它是一个公共事件，公开揭露，公开讨论。他们的审查员叫大审查官，每个人都知道他的名字，了解他的规章。美国这种意识形态在我们学校、电视节目和广告中逐渐消失，转而被一小群媒体所有者和政府官员秘密地实施。这就是我们几乎没人相信媒体的原因：我们知道我们了解到的是片面的事实，却不知道是谁在误导我们。

 -------------译者：haleyyen-审核者：skysonssk------------

 

Nor is Chinese education "first and foremost a device for enforcing Party ideology to the young and impressionable minds" any more than it is in Western schools. It's part of acculturation. In France French ideology is inculcated in all classrooms (which teach an identical cultural curriculum) every day as an essential foundation of French culture. The French are rightly proud of their culture and want to pass it on to their children.

不仅中国把教育当做传输政党观念给年轻人的手段，在西方学校里这种行为更甚。它是社会教养的一部分。在法国，每天所有教室里灌输的都是法国的意识形态，课堂上教授的是相同的文化课程， 这是法国文化的基石。法国人为他们的文化感到骄傲是正确的，并且要把这些文化传给他们的孩子。
 
As to Forbes’ nonsense about rote learning in China it's a misapprehension. Sure the Chinese rely on rote learning more that we do for appropriate subjects like arithmetic. The reasoning is that most people are not cut out for abstract thought but multiplication tables and mental arithmetic are survival skills that will get them through life. In any case Chinese pupils use rote learning less than we do because they know its limitations.

还有福布斯关于中国人机械学习的荒谬说辞，这是个误解。诚然，中国人在某些特定科目上比我们更依赖死记硬背，例如算术。其原因在于不是每个人都适合进行抽象思考的，而乘法表和心算却是他们终生受用的谋生技能。不管怎样，中国学生对于机械的学习方法的使用少于我们，因为他们也了解这种方法的弊端。


 
If you doubt me read some gaokao questions from past years. They're so subtle and ambiguous that they would cause howls of outrage if given to average US students. Here’s an easy one:

如果你怀疑我说的话，尽可以去看看过去几年的高考题。题目设计精巧而且难度很大，如果把这些题给一个中等的美国学生，他可能会一声怒吼。给大家一个简单的题目做例子。

-------------译者：haleyyen-审核者：skysonssk------------

In a letter to James Madison in March 1787 George Washington wrote “That a thorough reform of the present system is indispensable none who have capacities to judge will deny—and with hand and heart I hope the business will be essayed in a full Convention.”

1787年3月， 在一封写给 詹姆士.麦迪逊的信中，乔治.华盛顿写道，“对现有体制的彻底改革是必不可少的，有判断能力的人都不会否认这点---我真诚地希望可以在全体会议上提出这项改革。”
 
Q. What does the “thorough reform” refer to?  

彻底的改革指的是什么？
 
A. eradicate defect of federal system  

根除联邦体系的缺陷
 
B. establish republic system with check and balance of three powers  

建立可以监督和制约三权分立的共和体制
 
C. abolish constitutional monarchy

废除君主立宪制
 
D. change the loose federal system

改变松散的联邦体制
 
All of this is not to say that the Chinese system is perfect. Far from it. But 3 of the 5 top scoring school systems in the world are Chinese and the average Chinese school (as sampled by the OECD) is about as good as the OECD average. That's a harbinger of things to come. If you want to see what the best school system in the world looks like read Shanghai’s Education Secrets.

这并不是说中国的体系就是完美无缺的。实际上离完美还有很长一段路要走。但是世界上排名前五的学校系统中，中国有三个。 通过经合组织的抽样调查发现，中国和经合组织的中等学校的水平不相上下。这是未来的预兆。如果你想知道世界上最好的学校系统是什么样的，那么你可以看看《上海的教育秘密》这本书。

-------------译者：haleyyen-审核者：skysonssk------------

Paul Denlinger Have lived in China Taiwan and Hong Kong; fluent in Mandarin (written spoken)

paul denlinger 一直住在中国台湾和香港，普通话流利（书面+口语）

Answered Dec 3 2012
No not really.

不见得。
 
Since China wants to become more developed the main emphasis is on the disciplines which are more closely related to economic development: science and math.

因为中国想要变的更发达，所以将重点放在了学科建设上，尤其是与经济发展相关的学科，比如科学和数学。

The current education system is more geared to that. Chinese students are more noted for their hard-skill expertise than their soft skills. That is natural.

 现在的教育系统更加适合于实现这个目标。 比起软技能，中国学生被人们熟悉的是他们的硬技能专业知识。那是自然而然的。

But many Chinese are now well-off enough to send their kids to school in Hong Kong the US the UK Canada Australia and New Zealand.

 但是现在很多中国人有足够的富裕，有能力送他们的孩子去香港、美国、英国、加拿大、澳大利亚以及新西兰去读书。

Those educational systems can help them offset some of the shortcomings of the Chinese educational system.

这些国家的教育系统可以弥补一些中国教育系统的短板。

The result is people who are strong in the sciences math and analysis but can then branch off into other fields often those which require soft skills.

 那得到的结果就是，  中国人不仅擅长于科学、数学和分析，而且拓展到了其他的需要软技术的专业学科。

That's a powerful combination.

强强联合啊。

-------------译者：Ness-审核者：skysonssk------------

Ozgur Zeren studied at Self Educated

Ozgur Zeren自学成才

Answered Mar 8 2016

Forbes is right to say that since for any Wall Street mouthpiece publication any non-totally-privatized education system is a blasphemy.

福布斯的说法是正确的——对于华尔街的媒体口舌而言，所有非完全私有化的教育制度都是在亵渎神明。

That does not change even if Chinese education as a whole tramples entire US body of students in STEM subjects. A tiny percentage of exceptional students which make it into MIT do not change the rule:

即使面对着中国式理科教育完全碾压了大部分美国学生的现况，这种论调也没有改变。少数考上麻省理工学院的优秀学生并不能改变这种现况：

American Students Fall in International Academic Tests Chinese Lead the Pack

美国学生在国际学术测试中遇挫，而中国学生登顶。

Infographic: China Ahead of US and Germany in Educational Technology

图表：中国在教育技术领先美国和德国

Why East Asian Students Are Superior

为什么东亚学生表现优秀

When even WSJ starts conceding the point you know something is going real bad.

当华尔街日报开始承认这一点的时候，你知道有些事情真的很糟糕。

-------------译者：Mr.ceer-审核者：skysonssk------------

The actual question is why are there people who still read publications like Forbes Economist WSJ NYT and buy the corporate rhetoric they sell.

真正的问题是为什么这些人仍然在阅读像福布斯、经济学人、华尔街日报和纽约时报这样的出版社并且相信这些媒体兜售的信息。
 
These publications have no obligation to relay the truth. The profits the shareholders of these corporations will make from their other corporate share-holderships by pushing policies that will make them profit far surpass the profits which they will make from the ad or subscxtion revenue they get from the publications themselves.

这些媒体没有义务完全传达事实。这些公司的股东可以通过作为其他公司的股东获得更多的利益，远比通过这些媒体自己接广告或者subscxtion更多。
 
These publications had no issue pushing Iraq war on non existent weapons of mass destruction. They had no shame afterwards either. The same with the first Iraq war with Nayirah Lie.

这些媒体对于根据一个根本不存在的大规模杀伤性武器推动伊拉克战争没有任何心理负担，毕竟他们根本不要脸。同样的由于Nayirah的谎言引起的第一次伊拉克战争也是如此。
 
Trusting these publications after these episodes goes beyond reason.

当真相被掩盖后再相信这些出版社吧。

-------------译者：Mr.ceer-审核者：skysonssk------------
 
Joseph Wang Chief Scientist Bitquant Research
Answered Apr 12 2013
There are some good reasons why the system is what it is.

关于为什么教育系统会是现在的样子我有几个充分的理由：
 
One reason that the Chinese educational system focuses so much on memorization and standardized examinations is that:

其中之一是中国的教育系统过分的关注在记忆和标准化的考试上：
 
1) it's easy to hire teachers to teach memorization

1）这样雇佣老师来让他们死记硬背很容易
 
2) there's much less possibility for corruption in a memorization system.  You memorize the answers you take the test based on the scores you get in or not.  If you have any sort of human intervention you have a place where you can have corruption.  If you look at how difficult it is to get into an international school in China you see a large number of places where there is either direct or indirect corruption and if you make the educational system such so that  is based on "soft skills" then you add to the places where the poor and unconnected are at a disadvantage.

2）在一个基于记忆的系统下将不会有太多的可能性来贪污腐败。你参加考试能不能得分取决你有没有记住答案。如果有任何可以人为干预的方法就会有可以腐败的地方。如果你去看看在中国进入一个国际化学校有多困难，你就会看见大量地方存在的直接或间接的腐败。如果你制作一个基于“软性技能”教育系统，那你就增加了那些贫穷落后与世隔绝的地方的劣势。

-------------译者：Mr.ceer-审核者：skysonssk------------

3) One good thing about a system based on memorization is that you don't have to believe any of it.  The tests measure how much you've memorized the official history and the official interpretation of literature.  They don't ask any questions that require the student to express what they think about it. 

3）基于记忆的系统的优势就是你不必完全相信任何你学到的。考试仅仅测试你记住了多少官方历史和官方翻译的文学作品。他们不会询问任何需要学生表达自己的理解的问题。
 
If I had to give a "Chinese style" test on politics it would see if people memorized the latest political buzzwords.  Here is a speech by Xi Jinping.  I'll ask you to memorize it.  Now if you have a system in which a student had to *critique* that speech and explain what *they thought of it* that would be both cruel and dangerous.

如果我不得不参加一个“中国式”的政治考试，它会考察人们是否记住了最新的政治术语。这里有一篇习大大的演讲，我会让你记住它。现在如果你有一个系统，它让学生必须“评论”这篇演讲，表达“对篇演讲的看法”这也太残酷危险了吧。

 -------------译者：一抹夏凉-审核者：skysonssk------------

Robin Daverman
Robin Daverman, World traveler
Answered Jun 11, 2015
No. I don't know why people keeps on saying that the Chinese education system emphasizes memorization. The high-school math in China is probably three years ahead of the US. Math test in SAT is the equivalent of a 6th grade math in China. I have yet to meet anybody who can solve math problems by memorization.
The Forbes article is a political hit piece. The smart kids in China are all going after the science track, which means they'll be tested on the following 6 subjects in GaoKao: Chinese, Math, English, Physics, Chemistry, and Biology. I don't know what "grade" the author was when she read Hans Andersen's fairy tale in class and developed an objection to her teacher's interpretation, but seriously, most kids wouldn't be caught dead reading a fairy tale by 7 years old. One can't seriously think that a reading of "the little match girl" or "Cinderella" represent the height of Chinese education.
PS: A good comment from Qian Qin:
Science track is usually perceived to be more competitive in the future job market, as a result the majority(70% maybe?) of Chinese students go on this track. However I wouldn't say students in either track are smarter than ones in the other. Both tracks have very smart students, only in different ways.

Robin Daverman，一位周游世界的旅行者
回答时间：2015年6月11日
不，我不知道为什么人们一直认为中国的教育体制强调的是记忆（背诵）。与美国相比，中国的高中数学教育是超前的，大约提前了三年的时间。SAT的数学测试与中国六年级的数学水平是对等的。我从没有见过谁解决数学问题靠的是记忆。
福布斯的文章带有政治打击的性质。聪明的中国小孩都要遵循科学的教育轨迹，也就是说他们在高考中要接受六门功课的测试：语文、数学、英语、物理、化学和生物。我不知道作者在课堂上读安徒生童话并且渐渐不赞同老师的解释的时候是“几年级”，但是一般来说大多数孩子在七岁的时候就不会被要求读童话故事了。所以我们不能简单的认为中国教育的高度就是读“卖火柴的小女孩”或者“灰姑娘”。
附：来自Qian Qin的较好的评论：
 通常认为在未来的工作市场中，遵循科学的轨迹是有竞争力的，中国的学生大部分（也许是百分之七十）都遵循这个轨迹。
然而我并不是说在一个轨迹中的学生会比在另一个轨迹中的更优秀。所有的路径都有聪明的学生，只是途径不同而已。

 -------------译者：少皞一世-审核者：skysonssk------------

Li Jun Love thinking philosophy and programming. Know a lot about Chinese and China
Answered Jun 14 2015
Achilles in fairytale has only one weak point but China has many.  Obviously China is not Achilles so she does not have Achilles Heel. Say nothing about education system might not be the real weakness of China.

在神话中阿喀琉斯只有这么一个弱点，而中国有很多弱点。很显然中国不是阿喀琉斯所以她没有阿喀琉斯之踵。教育系统没有发声并不能说明它就是中国真正的弱点。

Furthermore I think it is too complex to give an simple conclusion of "right" or "wrong" to China's education system.

此外我认为，对于中国的教育体系而言，不能简单地得出“正确”或“错误”的结论。

I briefly read the article in Forbes website I think its target is to argue China's education system serves for the CCP so it is problematic. It is too political and too biased. And I can not find the clear logic from "The problem of China's education system" to "It is the Achilles Heel of China".

我在福布斯网站上简略地阅读了这篇文章，我认为它的目标是证明中国的教育体系是为中国共产党服务的，所以它是有问题的。它太政治化，也太有偏见。而且从“中国教育体系的问题”引申到“中国的阿喀琉斯之踵”， 在这点上我无法找到清晰的逻辑。

I am totally lost in the author's second sub-heading: Private Schools as an Alternative. What he discussed under this heading had little to do with private schools and I found no clue to the key word "alternative" at all. BTW IMHO private school is a poison to China.

同时我对作者的第二个小标题（私立学校是一个替代物）感觉到迷惑。他在这个标题下讨论的内容与私校没有太大的关系，而且也完全没有找到有关“替代物”的关键词。而且恕我直言，私校对中国来说是毒药。
 
In summary the article is telling nonsense.

总的来说，这篇文章一派胡言。

 -------------译者：Mr.ceer-审核者：skysonssk------------

Gwydion Madawc Williams retired computer analyst and widely read on history and science
Answered Dec 4 2012
China doesn't have huge numbers of people believing in nonsense like Creationism as happens in the USA.  It also has a continued respect for education which has weakened in the West.

中国不像美国一样，并没有大量的人相信愚蠢的神创论。他们仍旧尊崇教育不像西方一样弱化它。
 
It is also remarkable how Western journalists keep on predicting something terrible about to happen to China and it never does.  They can't bear to think that a foreign country might flourish while ignoring their advice.

这同样是不可思议的，西方记者仍旧不断预测中国要发生一些危机但从未成真。他们不能容忍一个忽略他们建议的国家可以繁荣发展起来。
 
Japan and Russia followed Western advice: look what happened to them.

日本和俄国接受了西方的建议：看看他们身上发生了什么。

-------------译者：Ness-审核者：skysonssk------------

Dingqi Zhang Native Chinese
Answered Sun
The ideology Chinese education system teaches is simple: materialism and dialectics.

中国教育制度的思想是简单的：唯物主义和辩证法。

Materialism means there's no god mandating what happens on earth nor can you do anything by simply relying on faith. Do you agree with that? If yes let's continue. That's why you need to investigate facts study the laws of physics use logic measure variables and resort to materialistic means on whatever undertaking you engage in. Doesn't it sound simple? Well how do you explain there are all those people in your world arguing against evolution against GMO food against abortion against LGBT by claiming that they are against the Bible?

唯物主义意味着没有神的命令在地球上发生的事情，而你也不能靠简单的信念做任何事。你同意这个观点吗？如果是的话，让我们继续。这就是为什么你需要调查事实，研究物理定律，使用逻辑测量变量，并用唯物主义的方法进行你从事的任何工作。听起来不简单吗？好吧，你怎么解释，世界上所有的人都在反对进化论反对转基因食品，反对堕胎，反对同性恋，并声称他们反对《圣经》？

-------------译者：周天寰宇2-审核者：skysonssk------------
 
Dialects means nothing is absolute. Everything has two sides. Not all is the same. Situation changes over time and space. There are important stuff while there are also unimportant stuff. It tells you not to be a bigot. Doesn't it sound too basic to you? If it's really that basic we wouldn't hear about all those annoying voices of liberals keyboard warriors backseat drivers and armchair generals. Also if those earth flatters and conspiracy theorists of all sorts knew to diversify their arguments they wouldn't cling on to their bigotry so fiercely.
The very purpose of what you call ideology education is to inhibit idiocy and promote science. It's where China's education is uniquely the strongest.

方言意味着没有什么是绝对的。每件事都有两面性。每样东西都不相同。情况随着时间和地点不断变化。有重要的东西也有微不足道的东西。这告诉你不要做一个偏执的人。它听起来不是对你很重要吗？如果是这样的话，我们就不会听到那些自由主义键盘斗士、后座司机和扶手椅将军的恼人声音。同样，如果地球上的谄媚者以及形形色色的阴谋论者都知道他们的观点要多样化，他们就不会那么固执地坚持他们的偏见。
你所谓的意识形态教育其目的就是抑制愚蠢和促进科学。这是中国教育最强大的地方。