【 Quora 】:曼德拉是个坏人吗？ [美国媒体]

Was Nelson Mandela a bad man?

【 Quora 】:曼德拉是个坏人吗？





Most people love and respect him, there is the minority that felt when apartheid was over he should have kicked all the white people out of South Africa and given the land and houses they occupied to the black people.
What those people failed to realize is that Nelson Mandela wanted South Africa to have a future , if he did what they wanted then S.A. would have ended up like Zimbabwe.
There are some people from other countries who think that he is a terriorists but they forgetting the real terriorists are those who started and supported apartheid, Mandela is a hero and a freedom fighter .
Mandela was an intelligent man and he chose to forgive so that South African people could heal and we could live together regardless of race.

大多数人都爱他，尊敬他，当取消种族隔离的时候，认为他应该把所有白人赶出南非，并把他们占领的土地和房屋交还给黑人。
有这些想法的这些人没能意识到的是，纳尔逊·曼德拉希望南非有一个未来，如果他做了这些事，那么南非.将会像津巴布韦一样。
有些来自其他国家的人认为他是恐怖分子，但他们忘记了真正的恐怖主义者是那些开始支持种族隔离的人，曼德拉是一个英雄和自由战士。
曼德拉是一个聪明的人，他选择宽恕，这样南非人民之间就可以痊愈，我们可以一起生活，不管种族。

He spent so much of his life in jail fighting for freedom , if he started a civil war then S.A. would not be at peace and in jail he realised that revenge is not the answer instead peace is.
Those who dislike him are clearly just malicious people.
Mandela unfortunately was released too late , if he could have been president longer than S.A. would be very different today, yes we would still have issues but different in a good way.
Nelson Mandela would not be happy with the state of the ANC today if he was alive, he would be dissapointed.
South Africa will never have another president like him ever. When he walked on stage people cheered, when he started speaking there would be silence because people were so interested in what he had to say, the respect he got from people was unbelievable, the love and admiration from all races was just amazing.

他一生中大部分时间都在监狱里为自由而战，他如果愿意发动了一场内战，那么他就不会安静，在狱中，他想到到的答案不是复仇，而是和平。
那些不喜欢他的人显然是恶意的人。
不幸的是，曼德拉被释放得太晚了，如果他能早点当上总统的话，今天会有很大的不同，是的，我们仍然会面对很多不同的问题。
如果纳尔逊·曼德拉还活着，他就不会对现在的非洲人国民大会感到满意，他会很失望的。
南非永远不会再有像他这样的总统了。当他走上舞台时，人们欢呼起来，当他开始演讲的时候，人们会保持安静，因为人们对他要说的话很在意，他从人们那里得到的尊重是难以置信的，并且收获了所有种族的爱和钦佩。

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I think i will let you decide whether he was a bad man.Firstly,he never committed murder,rape, fraud or theft.His “crime “ was simply to ask that all human beings living in South Africa be treated like human beings. He asked for equality for all and asked that the Aparthied government do away with its diacriminatory and dehumanising laws.This earned him a conviction of treason and he spent 27 yeara in prison.But the world saw his true nature,when he emerged from pruson.27 years of being falsely imprisoned is enough to make most men angry and bitter,looking for vengeance.Yet he forgave and was conciliatory towards those that imprisoned him.He chose not to seek punishment but chose to forgive on condition that people made voluntary disclosure of their part in human rights violation.Rhe result was that the Truth and Reconciliation Commission was formed.

我想我会让你决定他是不是坏人。首先，他从未犯下谋杀、强奸、欺诈或盗窃的罪行。他的“罪行”仅仅是要求所有居住在南非的人都要像人类一样对待。他要求人人平等，并要求政府废除其相互指责和不人道的法律。这使他被判叛国罪，并在狱中度过了27年。但是，当他从普鲁桑出来时，全世界都看到了他的本性情。27年的错误囚禁足以让大多数人愤怒和痛苦，去复仇。然而他此事原谅了，并对那些监禁他的人和解。他选择不去惩罚，而是选择宽恕，条件是人们可以自愿披露他们违反人权的行为。结果，真相与和解委员会成立了。

And unlike so many other leaders of liberation organisations,he only serves one term as President and stepped down.
He wasnt a saint nor did he wver claim to be a saint.He once said,”Iam not a saint,unlesa you consider a saint to be a sinner who is trying to be better”
So you judge for yourself.Was his actions that of a bad man?

与许多其它解放组织领导人不同的是，他只担任总统一职，然后直到离职。
他不是圣人，也从不自称是圣人。他曾经说过:“我不是圣人，你认为圣人就是一个只是试图变得更好的罪人吗？”
所以你自己判断。他的行为算是一个坏人吗?

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NEVER bad mouth Madiba in South Africa, we regard him as the father of our democratic nation. Sure, some of my fellow millennials don’t believe he should've been president (apparently Thabo Mbeki was groomed for it by his father, Govan. Thabo became the 2nd Democratically elected President) I personally think he was the right choice. HOWEVER, I don't agree with some of the stuff he did as President, But I digress. Without Mandela, we would all still be at each other’s throats, specifically the IFP & the ANC. In South Africa we don't like people who bad mouth him. I once overheard a foreigner bad mouth him and I went up to him and scolded him. No one will ever become a greater statesman than him. He’s up there with Lincoln. I shit you not, a few months after Madiba’s death in December 2013, there was some regional elections (I think it was regional) the ANC under Zuma used his death to attract votes, some of the posters said “Do it for Madiba”… The ANC is regarded as a joke now, they are nowhere near as revered as the ANC of the past. I had the pleasure of meeting Madiba and was able to chat to him for like, 30 seconds. I also went to school with his grandchild Andile Mandela.

在南非，曼德拉是我们国家民主的父亲。当然，千禧一代一些的人不相信他应该成为总统(显然，塔博·姆贝基是由他的父亲戈万为他培养的)。塔博成为第二民主选举的总统)我个人认为他是正确的选择。然而，我不同意他作为总统所做的一些事情，好吧我离题了。如果没有曼德拉，我们仍然会相互厮杀，特别是IFP &非洲人国民大会。在南非，大家不喜欢那些说他坏话的人。我曾经听到一个外国人说他坏话，于是我走到他面前，责备他。没有人可以成为比他更伟大的政治家。他会和林肯在一起。我不想骂人,曼德拉死后几个月2013年12月,有一些地区选举(我认为这是区域)非国大在祖玛用他的死来吸引选票,一些海报说“曼德拉做”…非国大现在被认为是一个笑话,过去他们远没有被尊为非国大。我有幸见到过曼德拉，并能和他聊上30秒。另外，我还和他的孙子曼德拉一起上学。

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Every great person have offended or is bad things on his or her to greatness. Greatness can never be achieved by being liked by every.no legend or great person was ever liked by every body which also includes ghandi, castro arafat and so on. To me, he was definately way more good than bad. Lots of the wide scale poverty is also driven by corruption and poor governance by the ruling party who didnt build on the structures created by apartheid. Eg; the current party has ruin the education system, security, health, water and sanitation etc. I dont blame the white man for this.

每一个伟大的人都存在对他或她的伟大感到不快或坏的一面。伟大永远不可能通过被所有人喜欢而实现。没有一个传奇人物或伟人曾被每个人喜欢过，其中也包括了甘地、卡斯特罗等人。对我来说，他肯定比坏的好。许多大规模的贫困也是由执政党的腐败和糟糕的治理所推动的，这些政党没有建立在种族隔离所创造的结构上。如;现在的政党已经破坏了教育体系、安全、健康、水和卫生设施等等。我不认为这是白人的责任。

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I'm absolutely appalled and ashamed at the answers I find here! Please don't regard them as a true reflection of what South Africans think of the man.
In all my years of living in South Africa, I have never heard anyone refer to him as anything but a hero and an inspiration. I can't imagine from under which rock these poisonous little naysayers have crawled!
His death was greatly mourned by South Africans and men great and small, from all over the world. Just listen to Barack Obama’s moving speech from his funeral about how Mandela inspired him 。
He spent 27 years in prison for fighting for basic human rights for all South Africans, which an overwhelming majority had been deprived of by a small minority. And yet when he emerged from prison, he didn't seek revenge on his captors! Or on the small minority who had oppressed his supporters! It is beyond me that the detractors in this forum don't have the grace to acknowledge the sheer magnitude of the act of forgiveness he offered them.

我对我在这里找到的答案感到震惊和羞愧!请不要把他们看作是南非人对这个人看法的真实写照。
我在南非生活的这些年里，从来没有听到有人把他说成是一个英雄和一个鼓舞人心的人。我无法想象这些有毒的唱反调的人在什么地方爬!
他的死受到来自世界各地的南非人和大大小小的人的哀悼。听听巴拉克•奥巴马(Barack Obama)在他的葬礼上发表的感人演讲:曼德拉是如何激励奥巴马自己的。
他为争取所有南非人的基本人权而在监狱里度过了27年，绝大多数南非人都被少数人剥夺人权。然而，当他出狱时，他并没有向逮捕者复仇!或者是向压迫他的支持者的那些少数人报复!在我看来，在这个论坛上的诋毁者没有那份心里美好，去认识到到他的宽恕行为的重要性。

Some people see the fact that Mandela didn't seek this revenge as a weakness or a failing, but it was at the very core of his philosophy and his strength to appeal to the greatness in people. I would venture to say that those who don't see him for the great and good man that he is are fearful and small in themselves.
A quote from one of Mandela’s speeches that expresses his magnanimous outlook:
“Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us. We ask ourselves, Who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented, fabulous? Actually, who are you not to be? You are a child of God. Your playing small does not serve the world. There is nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you. We are all meant to shine, as children do. We were born to make manifest the glory of God that is within us. It's not just in some of us; it's in everyone. And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our own fear, our presence automatically liberates others.”

有些人认为，曼德拉并不是把复仇看作是一种软弱或失败，而是在他的哲学核心和他的力量来使人们的伟大。我敢说，那些不认识他的人，会说他是伟大和善良的人，而只他是恐惧的和渺小的他自己。
从曼德拉的讲话中可以看到他宽宏大量的观点:
“我们最深的恐惧并不是我们信心不足。”我们最深的恐惧是我们的力量超越了我们的能力。最让我们害怕的是我们的光明，而不是我们的黑暗。我们问自己，我是谁?我是才华横溢、才华横溢、才华横溢?事实上，你不属于谁?你是上帝的孩子。你的小游戏并不适合世界。没有什么能让人明白什么是退缩，这样其他人就不会在你周围感到不安。我们都想发光，就像孩子们一样。我们生来就是要彰显神的荣耀。不仅仅是我们中的一些人;在每一个人。当我们让自己的光芒照耀时，我们要自然给予别人同样的放光许可。当我们从自己的恐惧中解放出来时，我们的存在会自动解放他人。

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Nelson Mandela is a strange anigma, loved much by those who hated him and those who once loved him are bewildered. He started in his Rivonia trial when he said he has fought against white domination and he has fought against black domination. Where did he fight black domination, who did blacks dominate. He fights 4 land and economic transformation all his life and when he is president he delivers none of those to his people. Instead he start preaching reconciliation without compensation, he makes black people feel guilty for wanting what was taken from them at gun point and due to exclusion from economy. He becomes a big hero for whites, he wears the rugby jersey and makes big statements that are really meaningless for poor Black people whom he failed to uplift. He dictates econonic policy to ANC that has destroyed manufacturing and created massive unemployment. He left us with deepening inequality, unemployment and poverty. Black people don't hate him, he is not their hero. If Nelson Mandela died a black hero white people would not adore him.

纳尔逊·曼德拉是一个奇怪的人，被那些憎恨他的人和曾经爱他的人所迷惑。当他说自己反对白人统治的时候，他开始了他的里瓦尼亚审判，他反对黑人统治。他到哪里与黑人统治斗争，黑人占统治地位。他一生都在与土地和经济进行斗争，当他还是总统的时候，他没有向他的人民提供这些。相反，他开始宣扬和解而不给予补偿，他让黑人要在被枪口上夺走的东西而感到内疚，并因此黑人被排除在经济之外。他成了白人的大英雄，他穿着橄榄球球衣，对那些他没能提升的黑人来说，是毫无意义的。他对非国大的经济政策进行了控制，该政策摧毁了制造业，造成了大量的失业。他留给我们的是日益加剧的不平等、失业和贫困。黑人不恨他，他不是他们的英雄。如果纳尔逊·曼德拉作为黑人英雄而死，白人也将不会崇拜他。

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Like all of us, he is no saint, flawed, intriguing and very much human. His final negotiations to liberate South Africa were flawed in that they kept most white previledges intact, such as land issue and broader exonomic inclusivity. How can, still today, have 5% of white population owning 95% of arable land? How do you justify that? why leave same white controlled economic structure as is, perpetuating black exclusion? How do you sustain a democracy with such growing inequality? Why beg white people to reconcile while they clearly are not prepared to live side by side with black people? How, as a black landless nation, do we move forward? How do we share in the wealth of the country? why do corporates still exclude blacks in meaningful positions and only relegate them to junior positions? Why if a black person makes economic progress is labeled corrupt and not deserving, by white controlled media? Why are incidences of white people doing horrible things to black people, such as burying farm worker, alive, in a coffin and attempt to burn him alive in the coffin? Why do whites call blacks baboons and hurl insults daily with no end in sight? with impunity? Why are blacks still excluded from using certain fascilities? Mandela legacy.

就像我们所有人一样，他不是圣人，是有缺陷的，有趣的，他也是非常人性化的。他关于解放南非的最后谈判是有缺陷的，因为他们保留了大部分的白色前缘完整，比如土地问题和更广泛的外部包容性。现在仍然有5%的白人拥有95%的可耕地?你如何证明这一点?为什么要保留同样的白人控制的经济结构，继续排斥黑人?你为何维持一个不平等日益加剧的民主?为什么要和白人和解，而他们显然不愿意和黑人一起生活呢?作为一个没有土地的国家，我们如何前进?我们如何分享这个国家的财富?为什么公司仍然把黑人排除在有意义的职位上，而只把他们降级到初级职位?如果一个黑人在经济上的进步被白人控制的媒体贴上腐败的标签，而没有得到应得的支持，为什么呢?为什么白人会对黑人做恐怖的事情，比如埋葬农场工人，活着，在棺材里，试图把他活活烧死在棺材里?为什么白人要称呼黑人狒狒，每天谩骂，却看不到尽头?而不受惩罚呢?为什么黑人仍然被排除在使用某些特殊装置之外?曼德拉的遗产。

South Africa is hell after liberation, blacks are worse off economically, except those co-opted by white companies for window dressing, or maybe closer to political power. Other than that, inequality grows much faster than the universe is expanding, let alone the speed of light through faster medium. Mandela failed us on economy, he thought through nation building, we will achieve utopia. He was an idealist, nonetheless.

南非是解放后的地狱，黑人在经济上更糟糕，除了那些被白人公司选为粉饰门面的人，或者更接近政治权力。除此之外，不平等的增长速度远远快于宇宙膨胀的速度，更不用说光速的速度了。曼德拉在经济上的失败，他认为通过国家建设，我们将实现乌托邦。尽管如此，他还是太过理想主义了。

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Mandela was a moral giant in the same class as Abraham Lincoln. He deserves all accolades attributed to him. Just like Lincoln, he was the right man to lead a country at a time of momentous transition. All South Africans owe him a huge debt.He admired Gaddafi, Arafat and Castro. But he certainly did not display the virulently anti-Semitic brand of Palestinian support 。

曼德拉是与亚伯拉罕·林肯同级的道德巨人。他理应受到所有人的赞扬。就像林肯一样，他是一个在重大转型时期领导国家的最合适人选。所有的南非人都欠他一大笔债！几乎没有人知道，曼德拉是萨共产党的终身成员，他深深敬佩苏联。我想，如果他是唯一愿意武装非洲国民大会的国家，我也会这么做。他说的关于共产主义的一些事情是非常令人尴尬的。他崇拜卡扎菲、阿拉法特和卡斯特罗。但他显然没有展示出巴勒斯坦人支持的恶毒的反犹太主义。