【reddit评论】特朗普下令考虑额外对中国1000亿美元商品征收新关税 [美国媒体]

President Trump on Thursday ordered the U.S. Trade Representative (USTR) to consider slapping $100 billion in additional tariffs on China, escalating a heated trade dispute between Washington and Beijing.

周四，特朗普总统下令美国贸易代表(USTR)考虑额外对中国1000亿美元商品征收新关税，这加剧了华盛顿和北京之间本就激烈的贸易争端。

The move comes one day after China proposed $50 billion in tariffs on a variety of U.S. goods in response to Trump’s own tariff threat. 

就在一天前，中国提议对一系列美国商品征收500亿美元的关税，以应对特朗普的关税威胁。

"In light of China’s unfair retaliation, I have instructed the USTR to consider whether $100 billion of additional tariffs would be appropriate," Trump said in a statement issued by the White House.

特朗普在白宫发表的一份声明中表示:“鉴于中国的不公平报复，我已指示美国贸易代表考虑额外对1000亿美元的商品征收关税是否合适。”

Trump also ordered Agriculture Secretary Sonny Perdue to ready a plan to protect farming interests from possible Chinese trade actions.

特朗普还下令农业部长桑尼·珀杜准备一项保护农业利益不受中国潜在的贸易行为影响的计划。

Trump’s decision could undercut ongoing efforts by U.S. and Chinese officials to calm tensions and prevent a full-blown trade war between the world’s two largest economies. 

特朗普的决定可能会削弱美国和中国官员为缓和紧张局势、防止世界上最大的两个经济体之间爆发全面贸易战的持续努力。

Just hours before the announcement, new Trump economic adviser Larry Kudlow tried to downplay fears that the conflict could hurt the U.S. economy.  

就在宣布这一消息的几个小时前，特朗普经济顾问拉里•库德洛试图淡化人们对这场冲突可能会损害美国经济的担忧。 

"Technically, both countries have just proposed tariffs. Nothing’s been enacted,” he told reporters at the White House. “I think that's an important point. Nothing around the corner. There's going to be a big discussion about it."

他在白宫对记者说：“从技术上讲，这两个国家都只是提出了关税，还未实施。”“我认为这是很重要的一点。没什么迫在眉睫的事情。将会有一场与此有关的大讨论。”

Futures for major U.S. stock indexes dropped after the president’s statement, a sign it could further inflame the upheaval on Wall Street over his trade moves. 

在总统发表声明后，美国主要股指期货下跌，这一迹象表明，他的这一贸易举动可能进一步加剧了华尔街的动荡。

But Trump doubled down on his call to impose $50 billion in tariffs on Chinese goods, saying that the country has “repeatedly engaged in practices to unfairly obtain America’s intellectual property.” 

但特朗普在他对中国500亿美元商品征收关税的呼吁中，称中国已经“多次采取措施不公平地获取美国的知识产权”。

“Rather than remedy its misconduct, China has chosen to harm our farmers and manufacturers,” he said.

他说:“中国没有纠正其不当行为，而是选择伤害我们的农民和制造商。”

The White House on Tuesday released a list of Chinese imports that could be subject to a 25 percent tariff, including electronics, shoes and furniture. 

白宫周二公布了一份中国进口商品清单，其中包括电子产品、鞋类和家具等，美国可能会对清单中的商品征收25%的关税。

Trump is using his presidential powers to crack down on Chinese policies that he says have gutted U.S. industries, delivering on a promise he made during the 2016 campaign. 

特朗普利用他的总统权力来打击中国的政策，他说，这些政策损害了美国的产业，这兑现了他在2016年竞选期间做出的承诺。

U.S. Trade Representative Robert Lighthizer conducted a Section 301 investigation that determined Beijing has unfairly forced American firms to turn over intellectual property and technology in order to do business in China. 

美国贸易代表罗伯特•莱特希泽进行了一项在“301条款”下的调查，该调查认定，中国政府不公平地迫使美国企业进行知识产权和技术转让，以便在中国开展业务。

Those concerns are widely shared among Washington politicians. But Republicans, and some Democrats, fear that imposing tariffs could spark a trade war that could stymie economic growth. 

这些担忧在华盛顿政界人士中得到广泛认同。但是共和党人和一些民主党人担心征收关税会引发一场贸易战争，从而阻碍经济增长。

“Hopefully the president is just blowing off steam again but, if he’s even half-serious, this is nuts,” said Sen. Ben Sasse (R-Neb.), whose state exports billions of dollars in agricultural products to China. “He's threatening to light American agriculture on fire.”

Sen. Ben Sasse (R-Neb.)说，“希望总统只是在再次释放压力，但是，如果他对此有点认真，那很愚蠢，”Sen. Ben Sasse 所在的州向中国出口数十亿美元的农产品。“他的威胁是要把美国农业架在火上烤。”

Conservatives also worry the trade dispute could undercut their message to voters ahead of the November midterm elections that the GOP tax cuts have helped the economy.  

保守派人士还担心，在11月中期选举之前，贸易争端可能会削弱他们传达给选民的信息，即共和党的减税政策帮助了美国经济。

China hit back against the U.S. on Wednesday, proposing 25 percent tariffs on imports of U.S. soybeans, corn, airplanes and automobiles — many of which are produced in states Trump won in 2016. 

周三，中国对美国进行了反击，提议对美国大豆、玉米、飞机和汽车征收25%的关税，其中许多是由2016年特朗普胜选的州生产的。

Trump took to Twitter on Wednesday to assert that the U.S. is "not in a trade war with China."

特朗普周三在推特上宣称，美国“并没有在与中国进行贸易战”。

“We are not in a trade war with China, that war was lost many years ago by the foolish, or incompetent, people who represented the U.S. Now we have a Trade Deficit of $500 Billion a year, with Intellectual Property Theft of another $300 Billion. We cannot let this continue!” he wrote.

我们并没有在与中国进行贸易战，这场战争早在很多年前就被一帮自称代表美国的“蠢货”、“无能儿”打输了，现在我们每年有5000亿美元的贸易逆差，还有3000亿美元的知识产权被盗造成的损失。”我们不能让这种情况继续下去!”他写道。

The U.S. had a trade deficit of $375 billion — not $500 billion — with China in 2017, according to the Commerce Department. 

根据商务部的数据，美国在2017年的贸易逆差为3750亿美元，而不是5000亿美元。


leochen 
Trump said in his statement that he’s directing Agriculture Secretary Sonny Perdue to use his authority to put a plan in place to protect agricultural interests.

特朗普在声明中表示，他将要求农业部长桑尼·珀杜利用职权制定一项保护农业利益的计划。

ydouhatemurica 
Can't he just subsidize Farmers affected by revenue from tariffs?

难道他就不能补贴下那些受关税影响的农民吗?

isysdamn 
They will just spend it on drugs and iPhones.

他们只会把钱花在毒品和iphone上。

CreepyOctopus 
I think it's fascinating to watch how Trump keeps testing his power and discovering that there are very real limits to it. Before entering politics, he has probably had to deal mostly with two categories of people - yes men, and people he could bully. Whether he's bad at business or not, he has billions of dollars, and lawyers, and a private security force. He could certainly intimidate or bankrupt most people he didn't like.
So then he becomes President and thinks he now has much more power because he still has all the money, but is now also in charge of the world's largest economy and military. And then he discovers that the President's power is limited by design. With his travel ban, Trump discovered that the judicial branch doesn't work for him and can work against him. Then, as he discovered with Sessions and Mueller, even the executive branch can work against him, or at least not the way he'd like. Trump discovered that no, the Department of Justice isn't like having his own team of attorneys, and the FBI isn't the President's personal police force.
Then Trump, who apparently doesn't quite understand what a trade deficit is and how tariffs work, starts talking about tariffs left and right, feeling that it's him/the US throwing his weight around. Only for him to discover that no, the Chinese government cannot be easily intimidated, and can retaliate by introducing tariffs in kind.

我认为观察特朗普如何不断地测试他的权力并发现它受到非常现实的限制是很有趣的。在进入政界之前，他可能不得不面对两类人——好好先生以及他能欺负的人。无论他是否经营不善，他都有数十亿美元，律师和私人保安队。他当然可以恐吓或使大多数他不喜欢的人破产。

因此，他成为了总统，认为他现在拥有了更多的权力，因为他仍然拥有他所拥有的钱，但现在他也掌管着世界上最大规模的经济体和军队。然后他发现总统的权力受到先天的限制。通过他的旅行禁令，特朗普发现司法部门不是为他而工作的，而且可以对他不利。然后，通过一些会议以及穆勒，他发现，即使是行政部门也能对付他，或者至少不会按他想要的方式运作。特朗普发现，不，司法部不喜欢他拥有自己的律师团队，而FBI不是总统的私人警察部队。

特朗普显然不太明白贸易赤字是什么，以及关税是如何起作用的，他开始谈论关税的各个方面，让人感觉他/美国在到处指手画脚。直到他发现，不，中国政府不可能被轻易吓倒，而且可以通过征收实物关税来进行报复。

mrfreeze2000 
The Trump organization is privately owned and run like a family business.
I've found that family businesses have no room for true meritocracy; they depend on kowtowing to the man at the top. Succession is not by rising through the ranks. It is by being related to the family.
If Trump was the CEO of a large publicly traded firm - like Rex Tillerson - he'd have a very different opinion on how decisions are made and how to build consensus.
But because he was the CEO of a family business, he still believes in those old-school ideas

特朗普集团是私人所有，经营起来就像家族企业。

我发现家族企业没有真正的精英管理的空间;他们依赖于对上级唯命是从。继承不是通过等级上升。而是与家庭出身有关。

如果特朗普是像雷克斯·蒂勒森这样的大型上市公司的首席执行官，他对如何做出决策以及如何达成共识有着非常不同的看法。

但因为他是家族企业的CEO，他仍然相信那些老派的想法。

nickfromnt
Good one. Although trump doesn't quite understand what a trade deficit is and how tariffs work much of anything...

干得好。尽管特朗普不太明白贸易赤字是什么，以及关税是如何起作用的……

CurryIndianMan 
Trump has neither the experience nor the capabilities to be the leader of a America. Doesn't mean that he wasn't voted in legitimately, it's just that people voted for the wrong guy. Decades of partisan politics have led many of the voters to disregard governance quality. They voted for the popular and loud man, and not the capable ones.
I seriously hope that we can recover from this poor showing and have people vote seriously the next time round.

特朗普既没有经验，也没有能力成为美国的领导人。这并不意味着他没有合法的投票，只是人们投票选错了人。
几十年的党派政治使得许多选民忽视了治理的质量。他们
投票给受欢迎和声音大的人，而不是有能力的人。我真心希望我们能从这次糟糕的表现中恢复过来，让人们下次再认真投票。

Anderson
Trump didn’t win the popular vote.

特朗普没有赢得普选。

AlreadyTaken
Voting doesn't mean the best person won, it just mean they got more votes

投票并不意味着最好的人获胜，只是意味着他们获得了更多的选票。

Flupen  
46.4% votes for Trump and 48.5% for Hillary, such a joke. Democracy at its finest.

46.4%支持特朗普，48.5%支持希拉里，多么搞笑。皿煮表现最好的时候。

PristinePlankton 
Punishing China with tariffs for how they've been ripping off other countries unchecked for years is probably the only good thing Trump has done so far. It doesn't seem like he has an actual plan though, as he's attacking Europe and others at the same time. Makes no sense. But fighting back against unfair Chinese trade practises is a good thing. More countries should do this. Too bad Trump's all over the place and no one is going to ally with the US at this point.

对中国征收关税，以惩罚他们多年来对其他国家的剥削，这可能是特朗普迄今为止所做的唯一一件好事。但他似乎并没有真正的计划，因为他正在同时攻击欧洲和其他国家。这毫无意义。但反击不公平的中国贸易的做法是件好事。更多的国家应该也这样做。糟糕之处在于特朗普思维混乱，因此没有人会与美国结盟。

funkme1ster  
I agree in theory that China is not the shining beacon of ethics and good faith it would be nice to have in a partner, but what's the point in trying to fight it now?
Globalization and outsourcing of manufacturing has made the consumption-happy western world critically dependent on Chinese business practices to feed their habits. Anything we do to "punish" them just turns around and bites us in the ass. 
Tariffs against China seem like cutting off the nose to spite the face.

我理论上同意，中国不是道德和诚信的灯塔，它本应该在合作中表现的很好，但是现在想要对抗它又有什么意义呢?

全球化和制造业外包已经使消费至上的西方世界严重依赖中国的商业行为来满足他们的消费习惯。任何我们对他们所做的“惩罚”只会反而让我们自食其果。

对中国征收关税，看起来就是“自作孽不可活”。

thedracle 
It has made our corporations fat and happy with record profits year after year, while real income and wage growth stagnates.
Deflation hasn't been a thing in the American economy for a very long time, which means most of the cost savings of outsourcing hasn't been passed on to American consumers.
Things aren't getting cheaper, just more profitable.
Worker productivity has risen sharply since 1970, while wages have remained mostly flat.
The U.S. still is a major manufacturing power, and still is the second largest manufacturing power in the world next to China in terms of raw output.
Can American factories pick up the slack? Or Germany, Japanese, and European factories?
Honestly I hope tariffs aren't the end goal here and instead the result is access to China's mostly closed economy.
I have worked at tech companies for years that basically have had our IP either stolen, or copied, by Chinese competitors. And generally we haven't been able to compete in China because we are not allowed to operate servers in China without partnering with a Chinese company, and giving all of our IP away to them.

它使我们的公司变得吃的又饱又高兴，年复一年地保持着创纪录的利润，而实际收入和工资增长却停滞不前。

在很长一段时间内，通货紧缩在美国经济中并不是一件大事，这意味着大部分的外包成本都没有转嫁到美国消费者身上。

商品并没有变得更便宜，只是更有利可图。

自1970年以来，工人的生产率急剧上升，而工资却基本持平。

美国仍然是一个主要的制造业大国，而且仍然是仅次于中国的第二大生产大国。

美国的工厂能填补这个空缺吗?或者是德国，日本和欧洲的工厂?

坦率地说，我希望关税不是最终目标，我期待的结果是能够进入中国基本封闭的经济中去。

多年来，我一直在科技公司工作，我们基本上是被中国的竞争对手窃取或复制了我们的知识产权。一般来说，我们无法在中国竞争，因为如果不与中国公司合作并将我们所有的知识产权交给他们，我们不被允许在中国运营服务器。

funkme1ster 
My father has a frxd copy in his office of a PCB he designed from a Chinese manufacturer that stole and produced it. He knows it's his because he published a copyrighted version on a message board back in the 90's, and they didn't even try to change his design (the layout is an identical copy).
He wasn't ever going to try and market it - it was primarily for some hobbyist friends of his - but now someone's profiting off him and he gets nothing.
Don't get me wrong, I have zero love for the concessions we have to make to them. It's a time bomb for our society and there's zero discussion of how we wean ourselves off it before we become truly helpless. I'm not opposed to fighting the system, just skeptical that resistance without an end goal gets us anything.

我的父亲在他的办公室里有一个镶框的山寨货，这个山寨货是中国偷窃并制造的他设计的PCB。他知道这是他的作品，因为他在90年代的时候在一个留言板上发布了一个受版权保护的版本，他们甚至没有试图改变他的设计(设计图纸完全的抄袭)。

他不曾去尝试和推销它——这主要是为了一些业余爱好者的朋友设计的——但现在有人从他身上获利，而他什么也得不到。

别误会我的意思，我对我们不得不做出的让步毫无兴趣。这对我们的社会来说是一个定时炸弹，在我们变得真正无助之前，我们没有讨论过我们如何摆脱它。我不反对对抗这种体制，只是怀疑没有目标的抵抗会给我们带来什么。

LordFauntloroy
Automation will produce goods cheaper than even Chinese laborers can produce it and all that industry will move to be closer to where it sells to further cut costs on transport.

自动化将生产出比中国工人生产的更为便宜的产品，而且所有行业都将迁移到更接近销售端的地方，以进一步削减运输成本。

thedracle 
I have little faith in the current administration. And I hope this isn't such a mess that it provides an example that will prevent us from reacting rationally in the future to guard our own economic interests as a country.

我对现任政府没什么信心。我希望这不是一场混乱，希望不要以此为例阻止我们在未来做出理性的反应以保护我们作为一个国家的经济利益。

PurpleProsePoet 
I'm pretty sure the TPP was supposed to address that, it specifically cut out China and thus encouraged investment in other Asian countries. Let US businesses find other homes for manufacturing so economic separation would occur over time without shocking the market.

我很确定TPP本应该会解决这个问题，它明确地削弱了中国，从而鼓励了对其他亚洲国家的投资。让我们的企业找到其他的制造工厂，这样经济分离就会随着时间而发生，而不会撼动市场。

thedracle 
Yeah, trashing the TPP was the wrong move, but I would rather see us trying to open more free trade with just South Korea, Japan, Australia, Mexico, and New Zealand.
Highly developed economies with high labor standards would put our manufactured goods on a more even playing field.
Also the UK would be a great opportunity for us now as a free trade partner.
Unfortunately our corporations have basically prevented the prospect of free trade with Europe because they're worried about the U.S. circumventing their agriculture and environmental regulations.

是的，破坏TPP是错误的，但我宁愿看到我们尝试开放更多的自由贸易，现在只有韩国、日本、澳大利亚、墨西哥和新西兰。

高劳动标准的高度发达国家会把我们的制成品放在更公平的竞争环境中。

同时，英国如今也会成为作为我们自由贸易伙伴的绝佳机会。

不幸的是，我们的公司基本上阻止了与欧洲自由贸易的前景，因为他们担心美会规避他们的农业和环境法规。

MrDannyOcean 
It's almost like the US should have stayed in the TPP, since it would have almost literally surrounded China with a trade bloc that makes up 40% of the world's economy and given the US enormous leverage to set the rules of the game.

看起来美国本应该留在TPP，因为它几乎完全包围了中国，TPP贸易集团占全球经济总量的40%份额，并赋予美国巨大的影响力来制定游戏规则。

bizaromo 
It may be good from your perspective, but it's going to cause a fair amount of economic damage to the US. There are other ways to move against China. The TPP was supposed to be a start, it had a very large section on intellectual property and copyright. Of course, China wasn't party to the agreement. But the Pacific nations that signed the agreement would no longer be able to purchase China's counterfeit products without legal consequence. The TPP was, in many ways, the part of the USA's long game against China.

从你的角度来看，这可能是好事，但这会对美国造成相当大的经济损失。还可以用其他的方式来反对中国。TPP应该是一个开始，TPP协议的很大一部分是关于知识产权和版权方面的。当然，中国不是协议的当事方。但签署该协议的太平洋国家将不再能够在没有法律后果的情况下购买中国的假冒产品。TPP在很多方面都是美国对中国的长期博弈的一部分。

mugsybeans  
The TPP would have effectively created much larger tariffs than what Trump is doing.

TPP将有效地创造出比特朗普如今所制造的更大的关税。

resuwreckoning  
Despite the angsty screeching about how the US is actually really weak , the Chinese have kept quite a few countries out of its own domestic markets while being able to sell in the US, which is the largest consumer market in the world.
If anything, in a game of chicken, it’s the Chinese that would likely have to blx first because while the US would probably need to pay more for soybeans or whatever, the Chinese would face millions upon millions of unemployed men who were expecting anything but being that.

尽管人们对美国实际上是多么的疲弱感到愤怒，但中国却让相当多的国家走出了自己的国内市场，同时能够在美国销售，而美国是全球最大的消费市场。

如果说有什么不同的话，那就是在一场懦夫游戏中，中国人可能首先会“眨眼”，因为美国可能需要为大豆或其他任何东西支付更多的钱，而中国人将面对数以百万计的无业男子，这些人期待着任何事情，但不是失业。

xXPostapocalypseXx  
Now on to more important subject: Foreign ownership of land and homes in the US. Soon millennials will not be able to afford purchasing homes/apartments because of all the foreign investments. Pretty soon they will be paying rent to foreigners.

现在来看一个更重要的话题:外国对美国土地和住宅的所有权。因为所有这些外国投资，千禧一代很快就买不起房子/公寓了。很快他们就会向外国人支付房租了。

reality_aholes 
Simple to fix that, massive taxes for every home ourside of your primary residence. Use taxes to fund public transportation and rezone low density housing to high rises.
Foreigners want to own over priced properties they don't intend to live in? Have them fund our new housing developments.

解决这个问题很简单，对你的主要居住地的每个家庭都征收重税。利用税收为公共交通和低密度住房提供资金。

外国人想要拥有他们不打算居住的高价房?让他们为我们的新住宅开发提供资金吧。

roxasx12  
God, I love trade wars! I don't think they ever end well!

天啊，我喜欢贸易战!我认为他们永远不会结束!

TimWebbOne 
Trade wars are easy to win!!

贸易战很容易赢!!

Morgax 
Trump's behavior and policies are certainly problematic, but I think you severely underestimate how corrupt the US government is from being subverted by corporate and competing interests.

特朗普的行为和政策当然是有问题的，但我认为你严重低估了美国政府是如何被企业和竞争利益颠覆的。

mugsybeans 
China already has tariffs on all US goods. Unfortunately for China, what we do export to China they need which is food. They cannot produce enough for themselves so they are, in essence, fucking themselves.

中国已经对所有美国商品征收关税。不幸的是，对于中国来说，我们出口到中国的是他们需要的食品。他们不能为自己生产自给自足的食品，所以本质上，他们就是在自虐。

crypto_took_my_shirt 
he becomes President and thinks he now has much more power because he still has all the money, but is now also in charge of the world's largest economy and military.
Nobody believes the President has been anything more than a figurehead for decades. Look at any bill Obama tried to pass that was blocked, or the war Bush started for Daddy's friends like Cheney.
The group around the President tells him what they're doing and he has to sell it. The opposing party starts their attack to the media and public about why it is bad and they should be in power...
This is how politics works, Trump knows this, the world knows this. It's just a different person carrying out the groups orders.

他成为了总统，并且认为他现在拥有了更多的权力，因为他仍然拥有所有的钱，但是现在他也掌管着世界上最大的经济和军队。

没有人相信总统在过去几十年里一直是一个有名无实的首脑。看看奥巴马试图通过的任何被驳回的法案，或者是布什总统为像切尼这样的他父亲的朋友们开启的战争。

总统身边的一些人告诉他他们在做什么，他必须卖掉它。反对党开始向媒体和公众发起攻击，告诉他们为什么这样做不好，他们应该掌权……

这就是政治运作的方式，特朗普知道这一点，全世界都知道这一点。只不过是换一个不同的人执行这些人的命令。

Burning_Lovers
it's more like a different set of groups entirely, the main people around Trump and fueling Trump are hardcore nationalists
they follow a way different ideology in many respects than the people who would normally surround a Republican POTUS

这更像是一群完全不同的人，特朗普身边的主要人物和支持特朗普的人都是强硬的民族主义者。
他们在很多方面都遵循着一种与通常围绕在一个共和党人的总统周围的人不同的意识形态。

rockjay 
They are running out of stuff to tariff.  Plus what they do import is FOOD.

他们的东西快用完了。而且他们进口的是食物。

i_already_forgot 
A rise in meat prices isn't going to kill anyone. What, you think they actually eat that much soy?
It's feed for livestock.

肉类价格上涨不会导致任何人死亡。你觉得他们真的吃了那么多大豆吗?
那是家畜的饲料。

thedracle  
No, just losing all of their factory jobs and having millions out of work because they suddenly have 100 billion dollars in excess product flooding their market.

不，只是失去了所有的工厂工作，还有数百万的失业，因为他们突然有1000亿美元的过剩产品涌入他们的市场。

i_already_forgot 
A million people in China is a drop in the ocean. A few thousand people in the right locations in America is enough to swing an election.

在中国一百万人就是沧海一粟。在美国，几千个人在合适的地方，就足以左右一场选举。

badamache 
Annual US imports from China are about $460 billion/year. So if these tariffs were in place, everything you buy from China would increase in price by ~21%. So, a $100 bill at Wal Mart would be $121. How does this help people?

美国每年从中国的进口约为4600亿美元。因此，如果这些关税到位，你从中国购买的所有商品的价格将会上涨21%。沃尔玛原来卖100美元的商品会变成121美元。这对人们有什么帮助?

oh_horsefeathers  
That's the real irony of it. The same communities that voted most strongly for Trump are likely to be the hardest hit if these threats become a reality.

这才是真正的讽刺。如果这些威胁成为现实的话，那些投票支持特朗普的社区可能会受到最严重的打击。

bizaromo 
Honestly, most nations go for US agricultural products when it comes to retaliatory tariffs because we're a bread basket.

说实在的，大多数国家在施行报复性关税的时候都会选择美国农产品，因为我们是个产粮国。

hurtsdonut
It's intentional. They want to hurt Trump's supporters so they don't vote for him again. It's simple and effective. They've done it before. Trump just stepped into a chess match and he's completely over played himself.

这是故意的。他们想要伤害特朗普的支持者，这样他们就不会再投票给他了。这是简单而有效的。他们之前已经这么做过。特朗普刚刚迈入了一场国际象棋比赛，他完全玩过头了。

PetitsVerres 
China knows that trade wars are easy to win.

中国知道，贸易战很容易赢。

Dick_Lazer 
If Trump issues more tariffs China will likely respond in turn, and it's not uncommon for countries to target the products that would hurt a politician's voters the most.

如果特朗普对中国征收更多关税，中国可能会做出相应的回应，而对很多国家来说，针对那些会伤害到政客选民的产品，也并不罕见。

canyouhearme 
China's retaliation is putting tariffs on things like blue jeans. The blue jean market would then lose jobs because of a decrease in production since the Chinese will stop buying overpriced blue jeans.
Difference is china can quickly and easily substitute US jeans with Chinese jeans (probably even with the same branding). Whereas the US doesn't have the capacity to replace, say raw steel, in the short term, just meaning that prices rise.
And china has the big stick in that they could tax/ban chinese investment in the US and crater the economy as the financing disappears.

中国的报复措施是对蓝色牛仔裤征收关税。由于中国将停止购买价格过高的蓝色牛仔裤，蓝色牛仔裤市场将因此失去工作。

不同之处在于，中国可以迅速而轻松地用中国牛仔裤替代美国牛仔裤(甚至可能是同样的品牌)。然而，在短期内，美国并没有钢铁替代能力，这就意味着价格上涨。

此外，中国还有一根大棒，那就是他们可以对中国在美国的投资征税，并在融资消失时对美国经济造成冲击。

TheAluminumGuru  
I don’t agree with this move, but I think the idea is probably to get leverage here for future trade negotiations rather than to be a permanent thing. I think the Trump administration is betting that a trade war would hurt China more than us (which is probably true), since China does not have enough domestic demand to make up for a big loss in exports. This part is not necessarily illogical.
Where it gets very illogical is the thinking that they can put the screws on China this way and then bring them to the table to agree to some long-term concessions, which would be per se better for America. This not only assumes that trade is a zero-sum game but also ignores the fact that China is stubborn as hell and essentially has a gigantic chip on its shoulder over getting pushed around by western countries.

我不同意这种做法，但我认为这个主意很可能是为了在未来的贸易谈判中发挥作用，而不是真的长期固定下来。我认为，特朗普政府认为，贸易战对中国的伤害比对美国更大(这可能是事实)，因为中国没有足够的国内需求来弥补出口的巨大损失。这个想法的这一部分不一定不合逻辑。

这种想法很不合逻辑的地方在于，认为他们可以通过这种方式对中国施加压力，然后让他们坐到谈判桌前，接受一些长期的让步，这对美国来说更有利。这不仅假设贸易是一场零和游戏，而且也忽略了一个事实，即中国是一个顽固的国家，在西方国家的推波助澜下，它也有一个巨大的筹码。

badamache  
That's a good point.

很不错的观点

jreff22  
They have stolen IP and produced products without the original company getting a dime.

他们窃取了知识产权，生产出的产品没有让原来的公司获利一分钱。

feeltheslipstream  
The original company got paid with cheap labour. They knew what they were doing. China copying stuff isn't some recent revelation. They weren't complaining when they got stuff built cheap. They are part of the problem.

原来的公司已经通过廉价劳动力获利了。他们知道自己在做什么。中国的抄袭行为并不是最近才有的。当他们买到便宜的东西时，他们并没有抱怨。他们也是问题的一部分。

skipperdude 
The US government didn't make the US companies go to China. The companies did that themselves looking to expand into new markets. They knew the rules China had for operating in their country, and they still willingly went in.

美国政府没有让美国企业去中国。是这些公司自己在寻求开拓新的市场。他们知道中国制定的在他们国家经营的规则，他们仍然很乐意进去。

tkdn2 
Companies have to do what they must in order to be able to compete. This means cheap manufacturing. Deciding not to manufacture in China is not something that is possible in many many many industries. The Chinese know this and so they impose these laws and they even subsidize shipping to the US and European markets to significantly undercut all possible competitiors. They also actively engage in theft of information, whether its by planting a Chinese national in a company to leak secrets, by paying off employees, or though espionage. China CANNOT engage in unfair trade practices.

公司必须做他们必须做的事情才能获得竞争力。这意味着廉价制造业。在许多许多行业，决定不在中国生产是不可能的。中国人知道这一点，所以他们把这些规则强加给美国和欧洲市场，从而大大削弱了所有可能的竞争对手。他们还积极从事窃取信息的行为，无论是通过在一家公司中渗透中国公民，通过贿赂员工，还是通过间谍活动来泄露秘密。中国不能从事不公平的贸易行为。

skipperdude 
None of that is new information. The US companies knew all of that before going in, and they still chose to proceed.
Also, the US has one of the largest espionage networks in the world, and routinely engages in industrial espionage in other countries.
What do you think the NSA does?

这些都不是新信息。在进入中国之前，美国公司就知道这一切，但他们仍然选择继续。
此外，美国拥有世界上最大的间谍网络之一，并经常在其他国家从事工业间谍活动。

你认为国家安全局是（NSA）是干什么的?

cantheasswonder 
America is addicted to cheap, chinese made shit. We use it for a bit, then throw it away. We get it for cheaper than we should. Maybe now people will appreciate the things they buy a little more, and think twice before throwing them away only to replace them with a stylish upgrade.

美国沉迷于廉价的中国制造的垃圾。我们使用很短的时间，然后把它扔掉。我们买的这些垃圾比我们应该买的商品便宜。也许现在人们会更喜欢更贵一点的东西，并在扔掉它们之前三思而后行。

SlayersBoners 
This is the crux of the problem. The American general populace is addicted to cheap Chinese goods while the American corporations are addicted to cheap Chinese labours.

这就是问题的症结所在。美国大众对廉价的中国商品上瘾，而美国公司则对廉价的中国劳动力上瘾。

loscrimmage 
Based on what I know, I think the profit margin for the imported goods is usually multiple times higher than domestically produced goods (albeit higher quality). So the CEOs and other decision makers would prefer this way.
This is not specific to China. Wife complained about the India made Kitchenaid mixer had poor quality. The Indiana-made old mixer still works well after so many years.
Manufacturing outsourced to Asia is the result of capitalism. The pursue for profit is causing where we are today. If not China, it can be India or others.

根据我所知道的，我认为进口商品的利润率通常比国内生产的产品高出很多倍(尽管质量更高)。因此，首席执行官们和其他决策者更喜欢这种方式。

这不仅仅是针对中国的。我的妻子抱怨说，印度制造的Kitchenaid混合器质量不佳。但经过这么多年，印度制造的老式混合器仍然运转良好。

制造业外包给亚洲是资本主义的结果。对利润的追求导致了我们今天的处境。如果不是中国，还会是印度或其他国家。

mandarinfishy 
If these tariffs actually go through and this isn't a bluff the effects are going to be enormous. Trump proposed 50b in tariffs earlier and China responded with a similar amount. The stock market and commodities tanked then started to come back as some inside the white house started walking back the tariffs saying they didn't think they would actually go into place because there were negotiations ongoing.
Still the drop in soybean prices for example, was enough to knock all profit from most US soybean farmers. Meaning they would just break even for the year if prices didn't recover. Soybeans are a major crop in the US and China is 60% of our exports. There is no telling how bad the damage is going to be if China proposes 100b in tariffs on us tomorrow. If you're a farmer I would be terrified right now. Trump's entire economic team should be resigning if this isn't a bluff. Gary Cohn resigned after the mostly symbolic tariffs trump originally enacted on steel and aluminum and this is 1000x worse.

如果这些关税真的通过了，而不是虚张声势，那么效果将是巨大的。特朗普早些时候提出了针对500亿美元商品的关税，而中国的回应也差不多。股市和大宗商品价格开始回落，因为白宫内部的一些人开始退回关税政策，称他们不认为这些关税政策会真的实施，因为谈判正在进行。

例如，大豆价格的下跌就足以使大多数美国大豆种植者的利润下降。也就是说，如果价格没有回升，他们就会只不过收回成本。大豆是美国的主要农作物，中国占了我们60%的出口额。如果中国在明天对美国征收100亿美元的关税，那么损失将会有多大，目前还不得而知。如果你是农民，现在就会害怕。如果这不是虚张声势的话，特朗普的整个经济团队应该辞职。盖瑞•科恩辞职，原因是特朗普对钢铁和铝材征收的象征性关税，而现在的情况要糟糕1000倍。

Goldyhd 
Trump himself used Chinese steel in his buildings and has his clothes made in China. It’s Trump’s stupid blue collar base that doesn’t understand economics, trade policy and what trade deficits are. Nobody wins a trade war.

特朗普本人在他的建筑中使用了中国钢材，并在中国制造了他的服装。特朗普愚蠢的蓝领阶层支持者不懂经济、贸易政策和贸易赤字。没有人会赢得贸易战。

Reali5t  
China isn’t paying these tariffs, the American consumer will pay these tariffs. This is another beautiful way to tax the poor, others include gasoline taxes, alcohol taxes, cigarette taxes.

中国没有支付这些关税，美国消费者将支付这些关税。这是另一种对穷人征税的好方法，其他的还包括汽油税，酒精税，香烟税。

Nw5gooner 
As an outsider looking in, it looks awfully like your president is trying to distract from something. His efforts to provoke a real war on twitter petered out when NK started talking to people.
Now he's trying to do it with trade wars instead. Because that's got 'war' in it too.

作为一个旁观者，这看起来很像你们的总统试图转移注意力。当北朝鲜开始与人们交谈时，他在推特上挑起一场真正的战争的努力逐渐消弭。

现在他正试图用贸易战来解决这个问题。因为这里面也有“战争”。

TheAluminumGuru 
I don't know if it's a distraction, but it is likely that the timing of this has something to do with the midterm elections coming up in a few months. The conventional wisdom seems to be that the Republicans are going to get slaughtered in November, and will probably lose control of the House of Representatives and maybe even the Senate too. Democratic voters are super energized right now as a result of being outraged by the current government, whereas the coalition that elected Trump in 2016 has been comparatively apathetic. "Getting tough on China" generally polls well in the U.S., especially among the white working-class portion of Trump's base, who are starting to get disappointed with Trump's lack of progress on getting much done on immigration or other legislative initiatives. He's probably hoping to use this to get these people excited to go out and vote again in the fall and hoping that he will be able to use this as an opportunity to frx Democrats as being weak, elitist, and out of touch for not supporting the tariffs.

我不知道这是否是为了转移视线，但很可能这与几个月后即将举行的中期选举有关。传统的观点似乎是共和党人将在11月被虐，他们可能会失去众议院的控制权，甚至可能失去参议院的控制权。民主党选民现在因为被现任政府激怒而极度兴奋，而在2016年选举出特朗普的联合政府则显得相对冷漠。在美国，“强硬对待中国”通常很吃得开。尤其是在特朗普阵营的白人工薪阶层中，他们开始对特朗普在移民或其他立法举措上的进展缺乏进展感到失望。他很可能希望利用这一点，让这些人在秋季再次为其投票，并希望他能够利用这一机会，将民主党人视为软弱、精英主义，以及不支持这项税收的人。

jimmyolsenblues 
I think Trump equates Tariffs to approval ratings, if you look at his approval ratings since he started down this tariff run, his approval ratings are up. So I can see Trump continuing to pursue economics theory that is populism and not in the best interest of the market.

我认为特朗普将关税等同于支持率，如果你看他的支持率，自从为他开始降低关税，他的支持率就上升了。因此，我可以理解特朗普会继续追求民粹主义而非出于市场的最佳利益的经济理论。

Jaerba 
The people enamored with the US trying to punish China for being a bad actor in international trade are completely ignorant to the fact that the US is the 2nd worst actor in international trade.
You know which country also performs a huge amount of dumping and has been ruled against by the WTO? The US.
Edit: in fact, there are 40 open WTO complaints against China currently. There are 137 open WTO complaints against the US.

人们着迷于美国试图惩罚中国，因为其在国际贸易中扮演了一个糟糕的角色，但人们却完全无视美国在国际贸易中排名第二的事实。
你知道哪个国家也有大量倾销行为，并且被WTO否决过吗?美国。

注:事实上，目前WTO有40起针对中国的公开申诉。而针对美国的公开申诉有137个。

Froogler 
What are the odds of a scandal arising not in the far future where Trump and his associates are found to have shorted all the big US stocks ahead of his "trade war".
Maybe it's all a rouse to make money

在不久的将来，特朗普和他的助手们被发现在他的“贸易战”之前卖空所有大额的美国股票，发生这种丑闻的可能性有多大?

也许这都是为了赚钱。

ItsOnlyaFewBucks 
I am pretty sure Trump is short the market.

我敢肯定特朗普是在卖空市场。

jjjhs39
I'm not sure why people here and abroad act as if Trump is sane or competent. For many members of Trump's administration trying to minimize the damage from whatever comes out of that idiot's mouth is their full time job.

我不知道为什么这里和国外的人表现得好像特朗普是理智的或有能力的。对于特朗普政府的许多成员来说，他们的全职工作就是要尽量减少那个傻瓜的口误。

txanarchy
Good god this guy is a moron. Why won't he just go away?


天哪，这家伙是个白痴。他为什么还不离开?

HavockBlade  
i think that for whatever reason americans dont understand about china isthat they are prideful people. to save face in front of the world they will let their people suffer and the people will accept it as a sacrifice they should make--for china. i dont think americas ready to do that.

我认为，不管出于什么原因，美国人都不了解中国的是，他们都是些骄傲的人。为了在世界面前挽回面子，他们会让他们的人民受苦，人民会接受这是他们应该为中国做出的牺牲。我不认为美国准备这么做。

dog-dicks
Does anyone actually believe that a trade war with China helps the US in anyway?

有人真的相信中美贸易战会对美国有利吗?

Allan_Samuluh 
Well, China will win and Trump will lose in the next election. It's win-win situation.

嗯，中国会赢，而特朗普将在下次选举中输掉。这是双赢的局面。