今日俄罗斯称朝鲜不想重蹈伊拉克和利比亚的覆辙 [俄罗斯媒体]

‘N.Korea hopes to avoid tragic fate that befell disarmed Iraq & Libya’

朝鲜只是想避免重蹈伊拉克和利比亚的覆辙。



Pyongyang is not a threat. They have no territorial ambitions. Its priority is survival and independence, and that has always driven the North Korean nuclear program, Dan Glazebrook, political writer, told RT. John Bosnitch also joins the discussion.Russia and China offered their solution to the crisis calling it the 'Double Freeze' initiative.It calls for North Korea to stop its nuclear and ballistic missile testing. In return, the US and South Korea would halt their joint exercises near North Korea.However, the US dismissed the proposal.

概述：今日俄罗斯邀请John Bosnitch和政治作家Dan Glazebrook参与朝核问题的讨论。Dan Glazebrook认为朝鲜不是威胁，他们没有领土野心，他们首要考虑的是生存和独立自主。这也是驱动他们发展核武的原因。John Bosnitch说中国和俄罗斯提出解决朝核问题的“双重冻结”方案，要求朝鲜停止核武和导弹测试，做回回报，韩国和美国停止在朝鲜附近进行联合军演。然而，美国拒绝了这个提议。

RT:  How much of a threat does North Korea really represent to the US? Presumably if left alone, would it attack any other state?

RT：朝鲜对于美国来说到底是多大的威胁？如果不去管它，它会攻击其他国家吗？

Dan Glazebrook: No, I don’t think they are a threat. They clearly are not a threat. They have no territorial ambitions. Simply their priority is survival and independence, and that is what has always driven the North Korean nuclear program. As they have pointed out, they have seen what happened to Iraq after Iraq allowed itself to be disarmed by the UN. They saw what happened to Libya after Libya gave up its nuclear program. They are determined to avoid the same fate. They also remember what happened to them during the Korean War, when over three million people were killed in that war. More towns and cities were destroyed by US bombing in North Korea during the Korean War than in the whole of Japan or Germany during WWII. In fact, the US dropped more bombs on North Korea in the Korea War, than it dropped in the entire Pacific theater during WWII.

Dan Glazebrook:我不认为朝鲜是威胁。很明显，他们不是威胁。他们没有领土野心，他们首要考虑的是生存和独立自主。这也是驱动他们发展核武的原因。正如他们指出的那样，伊拉克允许联合国进行武器稽查，利比亚放弃了核武计划之后都发生了什么？这些他们都看在眼里，他们下定决心避免重蹈伊拉克和利比亚的覆辙。他们也都记得朝鲜战争期间发生了什么，300多万人死于战争，美国扔下的炸弹比二战太平洋战场扔下的还多，炸毁的城镇比二战炸毁德国或日本的还多。

So Britain and the US may have wiped this from their historical memory, but the Korean certainly haven’t. There are a large number of Koreans alive today who lived through that. They are determined to make sure that nothing like that happens again. And it is working because the US is backing off. Where is Trump’s “fire and fury” now? The best he seems to be able to do is to say that he is considering trade restrictions. He is looking like an irate clown, who’s just discovered that his flower won’t squirt. Even Nikki Haley – you know her belligerent sounding comments that North Korea is “begging for war.” That sounds to me like they [US] are setting themselves up for a huge climb down by saying North Korea is begging for war. Therefore we are not going to give it to them. The truth is: they have realized that their bluff is being called – they are not able to do anything about Korea. And the whole world is learning a very valuable lesson by comparing the fate of North Korea, which has its nuclear weapons program, and countries like Iraq and Libya, which gave it up…Kim Jong-un is not being paranoid. He is basing his policy on a very concrete, realistic analysis of the history of his own country, and the history of other countries who have been on the US hit list.

美国和英国或许把这些从历史记忆中抹去了，但朝鲜没有，经历过那些事情的人很多现在还活着，他们下定决心避免那样的事情再次发生。而且这管用了，美国正在后退，特朗普的怒与火在哪里呢？特朗普最多能做的就是贸易制裁。他看起来像个愤怒的小丑——突然发现手里的道具花不能喷洒了。甚至黑利（美驻联合国大使）——你知道，她有关于朝鲜的好战言论——朝鲜在“乞求战争”。这在我听起来就像是美国居高临下的对朝鲜说朝鲜欠揍。因此，我们要尽量避免这样的事情发生。事实是：美国已经意识到，他们的虚张声势被认为——对朝鲜束手无策。朝鲜有自己的核武计划，而像伊拉克，利比亚这样的国家则放弃了。比较它们截然不同的命运，全世界都会从中学到宝贵的一课。金正恩不是偏执狂，他的政策是经过非常详细，现实的分析，是基于本国，以及其他国家被美国打击过的历史的基础上做出的。

RT:  Do you think the US should tolerate a nuclear-armed North Korea?

RT：你觉得美国会容忍朝鲜的拥核地位吗？

DG: Yes, absolutely. The US and Britain have no stomach for wars where they might actually have any real repercussions. They only like to fight wars with impunity. They like to fight wars. Look at Iraq in 2003. They spent 12 years systematically disarming that country before they felt prepared to take on; Libya – they persuaded to give up its nuclear weapons program and so on. They don’t have the stomach for this kind of fight. They simulate these kinds of wars year in and year out with North Korea, and they always conclude that the casualties will be too great. And that was before there was even a nuclear weapon. There is no way they would have the stomach for that kind of fight.

DG：是的，毫无疑问。美国和英国没兴趣发起一些能让其真正付出代价的战争。他们喜欢战争，
喜欢那些不必付出多少代价的战争。看看2003年的伊拉克，在打之前，他们花了12年的时间去废掉它。利比亚，他们说服利比亚放弃核武以及其他。他们年复一年的模拟与朝鲜的战争，最后得出结论是，伤亡太大。这还是在朝鲜有核武之前。更别提现在了，他们对这种战争没有任何兴趣。

RT:  Do you think the US is right to impose this 'Double Freeze' solution put forward by Russia and China?

RT：你觉得美国是否应该推进中俄提出的“双重冻结”方案？

John Bosnitch: I think that a normal fair-minded person would ask why the US is opposed to that solution in honesty. The US already has intercontinental ballistic missiles pointed not only at North Korea but at dozens of countries around the world. When North Korea says that it wants to exercise a policy of “peace through strength” – that is not a translation from the original Korean – that it is the original talk coming out of Washington some fifty years ago. When North Korea is just copying Washington’s policy of peace through strength, I find it very difficult to understand the US response.

John Bosnitch: 我想任何一个诚实有正义感的人都会问美国为什么要否决那个方案。美国有大量的洲际弹道导弹，不仅对着朝鲜，而且还对着全世界的许多国家。当朝鲜想要实践实力换和平——这不是朝鲜发明的政策。这是华盛顿50年前发明的。我发现当朝鲜想要学美国的”实力换和平“时，美国的反应让人惊呆了。

RT:  Nikki Haley said that North Korea is "begging for war." Is that a strange choice of language to use?

RT：美国驻联合国大使说朝鲜在“乞求战争”，选择使用这样的语言风格，是否觉得陌生？

JB:"Begging for war” is the kind of phrase you hear the schoolyard bully using. I heard it in my youth and “you’re begging for a fight,” and so on. I don’t think that is the correct language to use if you’re attempted to achieve a diplomatic solution with respect to North Korea. Once again, we do have saber-rattling on both sides. Most people need to remember one very, very important thing: saber-rattling only makes a big, big noise when the saber stays inside the scabbard. And that is what is happening here: nobody is shooting anybody, nobody is launching any missiles at anyone. What we’re seeing is the setting of the stage for negotiations.

JB：“找打”我想你可能听学校流氓说过这样的话。我年轻的时候就听过“你找打”等等这样的话。如果你想和朝鲜达成一个相互尊重的外交解决方案，这并不是合适的语言。我再次强调，双方都有炫耀武力的行为。但是，炫耀武力并不意味着就真的要打起来。现在的情况是：没有人对着另外一个人开枪，也没有对着互射导弹。我们现在看到的是搭建舞台，为谈判做准备。



Odininasgard
Only a country with a nuclear deterrent can survive American influence, dictates and ensure its truly independent survival !

只有核威慑才能让一个国家免受美国的影响，确保其真正的独立生存。

Aussieone
We Aussieones support North Korea in the battle against the Zio US government.

我们澳大利亚人支持朝鲜对抗（Zionist？）美国政府。

dd
Thats untrue. US and Aussie are blood relatives. They support us 95% of the time. Just like we would support them if the Japanese planned to invade. 
Wait.. We already did.

这不是真的，美国和澳大利亚是血盟。他们95%的时间都在支持我们。如果日本入侵，我们也会支持他们。等等.....我们已经支持过他们了。

didi
hope yellowstone will explode soon and wipe out america from map

希望黄石公园爆炸，把美国从地图上抹掉。

GiveUkrainNuke
North Korea learned a valuble lesson from Russia's actions in Ukraine. Give up your nukes, and a bigger army will invade. Had Kiev kept their nukes, they would still have Crimea.

朝鲜从乌克兰学到了宝贵的一课，放弃核武，就要挨打。如果基辅有核武，也不至于丢掉克里米亚。

Skyrilla
Delusional much? They make threats to nuke their neighbors all the time. They desire to unify the two peninsulas under the Northern banner. Who is this guy?

在意淫呢？朝鲜一直在对其邻居发出核威胁，他们要求统一韩国。这家伙是谁？

Drago667
"Give up your pepper spray and I won't rape you" said the rapist.

强奸犯说：放下你的防狼喷雾剂，我就不强奸你了

Belisarius
haha and kim is a benevolent leader lifting his people higher and higher while their average length is shorter and shorter because of lack of food.

哈哈，金真是个好领导啊，带着他的人民越嗨越高了。同时由于缺乏食物，寿命却越来越短了。

Plato
Lack of food etc, is a result of us sanctions, NK would be foolish in the extreme, togive up its nuclear defence capability.

缺乏食物是因为美国的制裁。朝鲜在这样极端的情况下放弃核武防卫能力才是傻瓜。

k13
Not only Iraq and Libya ... How about Syria, Afghanistan, Yemen, Sudan, Serbia, Panama, Grenada, Vietnam, Korea, Guatemala, Nicaragua, and installing US-bootlicking dictators everywhere?

不仅仅是伊拉克和利比亚，看看叙利亚，阿富汗，也门，苏丹，塞尔维亚，巴拿马，格拉纳达，越南，朝鲜，危地马拉，尼加拉瓜，哪里没有美国的杰作？

Aqua a
There goal is independence they already have that . Kim needs killed , he makes his own people suffer and worship him like a god .

独立这个目标他们已经做到了，金需要杀戮，让他的人民受煎熬，像上帝一样膜拜他。