英国网友热议：中国这口大井 [英国媒体]

-------------译者：yearning-审核者：龙腾翻译总管------------



Oil is bringing China and the Arab world closer economically. Politics will follow

石油正在让中国和阿拉伯世界的经济关系变得更紧密。政治关系也将跟进。

FOR hundreds of years travellers have haggled over carpets, jewellery, spices and copperwork in the winding alleyways of Khan al-Khalili, Cairo’s traditional souk. Today the goods are more likely to have been mass-made in a factory in China than handcrafted in a local workshop.

几百年来旅行者们一直在开罗的汉.哈里里市场的蜿蜒小巷里讨价还价的买卖地毯、珠宝、辣椒和铜器，而今天如果想买这些手工艺品，可能就得到大规模生产这些产品的中国工厂里去了。

Trade is central to growing ties between China and the Middle East. It has increased more than 600% in the past decade, to $230 billion in 2014. Bahrain, Egypt, Iran and Saudi Arabia all import more from China than from any other country. China is the top destination for exports from several countries in the region too, including Iran, Oman and Saudi Arabia. In April Qatar opened the Middle East’s first clearing bank to handle transactions in yuan.

在中国和中东越加紧密的关系中，贸易是核心因素。在过去10年里，双方的贸易额增长了6倍，达到了2014年的2300亿美元。巴林、埃及、伊朗和沙特从中国进口的商品量要远多于从其他国家进口的。中国也是这个地区的几个国家最大的出口国，包括伊朗、阿曼和沙特。今年4月中东第一家经营人民币业务的清算银行在卡塔尔开业。

-------------译者：yearning-审核者：龙腾翻译总管------------

The trade is driven by China’s thirst for oil. In 2015 it became the world’s biggest importer of crude, half of it—more than 3m barrels a day—from the Middle East (see chart). By 2035 China’s imports from the region will roughly double again, reckons the International Energy Agency, far exceeding that of any other nation. “This is a big shift rather than incremental change,” says Chaoling Feng of Cornell University.

中国和中东之间的贸易之所以越加繁荣，是出于中国对石油的渴望。2015年中国成为世界上最大的石油进口国（每天300多万桶），其中一半都是从中东进口的（见下表）。国际能源机构预计，到2035年，中国从中东地区进口的石油将差不多翻倍，远超过其他国家。康奈尔大学的冯超龄（音）说，“这将是一个重大的转变而不是单纯量的增加。”

Even the Middle East’s poorer countries offer a fertile market for cheap Chinese wares. In 2013 Xi Jinping, China’s president, proposed reviving the Silk Road, an ancient trade route linking China to Persia and the Arab world. Chinese cars crowd the streets of the Egyptian, Syrian and Iranian capitals. Chinese-made clothing, toys and plastics are ubiquitous. China sells a lot of small arms too, according to the United States Institute of Peace, a think-tank in Washington, DC.

即使是中东最穷的那些国家都为便宜中国货开放了市场。2013年习近平主席提出了复兴丝绸之路，这是一条古代连接中国以及波斯和阿拉伯世界的贸易路线。现在埃及、叙利亚和伊朗的首都大街上到处都能看到中国汽车，中国制造的衣服、玩具和塑料制品随处可见。据一个华盛顿智库，美国和平研究所所传，中国还同时出售很多小型武器装备。

 


-------------译者：飞熊号-审核者：龙腾翻译总管------------

hedgieJan 20th, 04:39
Tottering towards economic implosion and yet stepping into the vacuum of global leadership by writing checks to satisfy the vanities of indeed a great "foreign policy" President.
Unfolding like a textbook of the lessons unlearnt from Japan's lost decades with humongous loss of its foreign reserves. At least Japan misused its Reserves to uphold internal collapsing soft infrastructures and has been a lesser "command and control" economy.
Kudos to this depletion of reserves for the President to bathe in the warm floodlights in the global stage. Global markets watch in glee and pray that all the ego trips fast translate to realities and not just rhetoric.

（国家）正朝着经济崩溃蹒跚而行，但是却通过开支票来搅进这个全球力量真空区（译注：指中东）以满足一个有着确实”伟大的对外政策”的主席的虚荣心。
一点没学到日本因为外汇储备的巨大损失从而导致日本失去的二十年的经验教训。至少日本是为了维持其内部正在崩溃的软基础设施才滥用了外汇储备，而且也变成了一个较为自由的经济体。
“荣耀”归于为了沐浴在世界舞台温暖的闪光灯下而耗尽外汇储备的的主席。世界市场正欢乐地围观，祈祷这些自我吹嘘能快点变为现实，而不是一纸华丽的辞藻。
 
guest-oowneeoJun 26th 2015, 06:17
Nobody is altruistic. As a Chinese, I could see that there are countless social problems that should be dealt with. China must protect its own interests before minding other countries ' business.

没有人是无私的。作为一名中国人，我能看到无数需要处理的社会问题。中国必须先保护自己的利益才能去操心别的国家的闲事。

-------------译者：飞熊号-审核者：龙腾翻译总管------------

east windJun 25th 2015, 12:57
....
...ANYTHING IS POSSIBLE...and I mean "anything"....
The USA is now the world's biggest oil producer
The USA may want to look for big buyers of oil as its customer --- after all the USA needs trillions of $$$$$$ if it wants to rebuild its economy
...HEY LOOK !!!!! ..."there is a big customer right there--- rrright....China of course...
Will American oil producers be looking at China as a big customer soon---.......well, you betcha .......

 一切皆有可能，我指的是“一切”
美国如今是世界上最大的石油生产者；
美国也许希望找到石油大买家客户——毕竟如果美国希望重建它的经济的话它需要N多万亿的美元；
嘿！你看！！那不就有一个大客户吗？——当然就是中国啦
美国石油生产商会马上就把中国作为一个大客户吗？——你还用问吗。。。

guest-oowainjJun 23rd 2015, 12:08
Chinese are cunning. They get oil & gas from ME without spending a coin, while stupid USA & Europe spent tons of money for stabilising ME but got only "hot air" from people of ME.

 中国人狡诈的狠。他们不花一分钱就从中东搞到了石油和天然气，而与此同时愚蠢的欧美为了稳定中东花了无数的钱，但是只得到了中东人的一堆空话。
 
Blossomingin reply to guest-oowainjJun 23rd 2015, 13:10
The USA and europe got more than that
But now it is all hard work agree.
China definitely the winners they played very smart

（回楼上）
欧美不止得到了那些东西
但是现在确实干的都是些吃力不讨好的的事情
中国无疑是赢家，他们玩得很聪明。

-------------译者：飞熊号-审核者：龙腾翻译总管------------

YoungWeberin reply to guest-oowainjJun 24th 2015, 00:35
"Stabilizing"; the West had done nothing, but de-stabilize the Middle East since WWI; and the Arabs never asked for their involvement to start. When you people learn to mind your own business, you will have fewer problems.

（回楼上上）
“稳定”——自二战以来，西方除了让中东更不稳定以外啥都没干；而且阿拉伯人从一开始就从来没有请他们卷进来过。等什么时候你们的人民学会管好自己的时候，你们的问题会少上许多。 
 
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happyfish18in reply to guest-oowainjJun 24th 2015, 01:57
Many neocon like to disparage the Chinese like Xi as cunning. But their staunchest partners in the ME, the Israelis minister's wife also disparage the dude as weak and black for not waging enough wars in the Ummah especially after the dude has the cheek to say that the West is still addicted to racism.

 （回楼上上上）
许多保守主义者都喜欢贬低中国人（例如习）狡诈。但是他们自己在中东的坚定盟友，以色列部长的老婆，同样也贬低她老公又软弱又黑，因为他没有在穆斯林国家发起更多的战争，尤其是在那家伙还有脸说西方人依然沉迷在种族主义中以后。

Fuduoduoin reply to guest-oowainjJun 25th 2015, 20:04
Stabilising ME? Where did you get that concept from? I guess CNN, Fox News, ABC, etc, right?

 （回楼上上上上）
稳定中东？你在哪里开的这个脑洞？我猜是CNN，福克斯新闻，ABC等等，是吧？

-------------译者：飞熊号-审核者：龙腾翻译总管------------

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guest-oowamsaJun 23rd 2015, 09:44
China is going to be worst off if the collaboration with ME continues. The worst has yet to come yet. China should work with Europe and America.

 如果与中东的合作继续的话，中国会变得糟透了的。最糟糕的还没有来。中国应该与欧美合作。

happyfish18in reply to guest-oowamsaJun 24th 2015, 02:02
We still do not know whether Xi will collaborate with Israel or Lebanon or Syria in One Road One Belt strategy into the Mediterranean. Obviously working with more European partners will make sense.

 （回楼上）
我们还不知道习在一带一路策略进到地中海地带的时候是会与以色列、黎巴嫩还是叙利亚合作。显然要与更多的欧洲伙伴们合作才对。

Fuduoduoin reply to guest-oowamsaJun 25th 2015, 20:07
To work with Europe and America to make ME a hell for the middle east people so that Israel feels more comfortable and safe?

（回楼上上）与欧美合作把中东变成中东人民的地狱，好使得以色列感到更加舒适安全么？

-------------译者：飞熊号-审核者：龙腾翻译总管------------

Strait_ForwardJun 23rd 2015, 06:14
This article misses couple of most important points:
China's renewable-energy systems are expanding even faster than its fossil-fuel and nuclear power. China leads the world in the production and use of wind turbines, solar-photovoltaic cells and smart-grid technologies, generating almost as much water, wind and solar energy as all of France and Germany's power plants combined. Production of solar cells in China has expanded 100-fold since 2005.
http://www.nature.com/news/economics-manufacture-renewables-to-build-ene...
The Chinese government has committed itself to producing 16 per cent of its primary energy from renewable sources by 2020.
http://www.unep.org/greeneconomy/SuccessStories/RenewableEnergyinChina/t...
It is projected that by 2030, 40% of China's powers sector will be powered by renewable sources. Current demographic projections show that 2030 will be the peak year in Chinese populous, a time when the population in China will start to drop, and will be aging.
Yes, in the short to mid term, Chinese demand for oil will increase. Essentially, the oil age is over. Two decades from now it won't make any economic sense to dig it out.
What China needs to worry, during those couple of decades, is the fate of the major suppliers - Saudi Arabia, the Gulf States, and Iran. Those will be consumed by war. if I was a Chinese, i would seek to increase my oil supply from Africa, South America, and North America.

这篇文章错过了几个最重要的点：
中国的可再生能源体系扩张得比它的化石燃料和核能更快。中国在生产和使用风力轮机、太阳能电池板和智能电网技术方面引领世界，产生的水能、风能和太阳能几乎和法国与德国发的电加起来一样多。中国的太阳能电池生产从2005年以来已经扩张了100倍。
http://www.nature.com/news/economics-manufacture-renewables-to-build-ene...
中国政府已经承诺到2020年16%的主要能源将来自于可再生方式。
http://www.unep.org/greeneconomy/SuccessStories/RenewableEnergyinChina/t...
计划到2030年，中国电力的40%将有可再生能源产生。现在的人口计划表明2030年将会是中国人口的峰值年，然后中国的人口将开始下降并老年化。
是的，对于中短期而言，中国对于石油的需求会继续增加。但是本质上而言，石油的时代已经结束。20多年后，将石油挖出来将变得不经济。
在这几十年里，中国需要担心的是主要石油供应者的命运：沙特阿拉伯、波斯湾诸国和伊朗。这些国家将消耗在战争中。如果我是中国人的话，我会去寻求增加非洲、南美和北美的石油供应。

 -------------译者：氯化钠⊙▽⊙槑-审核者：龙腾翻译总管------------

happyfish18in reply to Strait_ForwardJun 24th 2015, 02:08
It will be bad for dudes like Xi to get addicted to foreign Oil. With the economy slowing down, China should invest
more in domestic renewable energy, charging stations and electric cars instead of building more and more foreign
pipelines and oil terminals.

依赖外国石油不利于中国。随着经济发展速度减缓，中国应该更多的投资国内的可再生能源，充电站以及电动汽车，而不是建造更多的外国石油管道和油港。
 
Strait_Forwardin reply to happyfish18Jun 24th 2015, 06:50
I think China does invest a lot in renewable energies. Given its size, however, I also think it is unavoidable for
China to depend partly on petroleum in the short to mid term.
Given the Middle Eastern reality, China would better seek oil sources other than the Middle East.

中国确实对可再生能源进行了大量投资。但是中国需求量这么大，所以在中短期时间内，中国还得部分的依赖石油。考虑到中东现在的情况，中国最好去寻找其他的石油来源。
 
YoungWeberin reply to BlossomingJun 23rd 2015, 06:35
Wow, you live in a shockingly delusional world.

哇，你是住在一个臆想的世界么。

-------------译者：氯化钠⊙▽⊙槑-审核者：龙腾翻译总管------------

Blossomingin reply to YoungWeberJun 23rd 2015, 06:56
YoungWeber,
As you will learn with time, China will do more for American interests than any other single or collective policy of the Whitehouse or Pentagon.
The Chinese and USA relationship will become surprisingly strong after this 'skirmish' of interests passes over the coming years. Then your fears or wishes will shift.
So what are you afraid of? The fact that Chinese lessons to the world so far are resulting in mass and rapid militarization of two very powerful foes - Japan and India? Not to mention of what to do with 800 million poor who are watching Rolex's, Gucci Bags and Mercedes Benz clad elites get all the goodies?
Are you one of the lucky ones?

楼上的，
渐渐地你会意识到，中国给美国带来的好处比白宫或者五角大楼的政策给美国带来的好处要多。
在利益冲突得到解决后，未来中美的关系将变得史无前例的坚固。届时你的恐惧将变成希望。
所以你在怕什么？因为中国的原因而导致两个强大敌人（日本和印度）进行大规模快速的军事化？还有看着拥有劳力士古驰包和开奔驰的精英获得所有好处的那8亿穷人？
你是幸运的那一个么？
                                                                  
guest-ommijemJun 23rd 2015, 00:49
Islamic State is the direct consequence of US-led interventionism including war in Iraq and Syria, both of which China opposed.
So a question arises, why should China spend man power and money to clean the mess that was pretty much created by US?

伊斯兰国的产生是美国在伊拉克和叙利亚的干涉内政导致的产物，而这两场战争中国都是反对的。
那么问题来了，中国为什么花费人力物力去清扫美国造成的祸乱？

​-------------译者：逍遥俊马-审核者：龙腾翻译总管------------

台毒-害台湾in reply to guest-ommijemJun 23rd 2015, 01:40
China's president Xi said recently that China still has 80 million people (out of 1,350 million people) living under poverty. Xi calls and promised that these people will be eradicated of their poverty by 2020 or 5 years from now.
China will be kept very busy on that and will have no time or money to wipe the bottoms of others, except for humanitarian helps there.

回LS，
中国国国家主席习近平说，中国仍有8000万人（总人口13.5亿）生活在贫困之中。习近平承诺在2020年之前也就是5年内，让这些人摆脱贫困。
中国将对此花费很多的力气，所以没啥时间和金钱去处理别人家的烂摊子，除了些人道主义的帮助。
 
MySetDancerin reply to guest-ommijemJun 23rd 2015, 03:04
I agree that the U.S. created the instability in the region, which is what I predicted would happen and therefore opposed the wars. It did not take a lot of brains to see that one coming.
But the Chinese are not capable of "cleaning up the mess" without sending in a million man army and instituting genocide, which is very unlikely to happen. Russia, India, and the re-constituted Soviet Union (aka Russia) would crap, as would the E.U. With the region's oil going to China rather than the E.U., the E.U. would shrivel. Fortunately, the U.S. and Canada are energy independent.
Or something else would happen!

回LSS，
我同意美国让这些地区变得不稳定，这点我早就料到了，也因此我反对战争。而且这事的发生是显而易见的，并不需要多大的智慧去分析。
但是中国并不能够去“清理这一堆麻烦”，除非派遣个百万雄师过去进行种族屠杀，但这不太可能发生嘛~
俄罗斯，印度和复活的“苏联”（即俄罗斯）会放弃计划，把原来卖给欧盟的石油卖到中国区，那么欧盟就会压力山大。幸运的是，美国和加拿大都能能源独立。
拭目以待吧，也许会有别的好戏上演。

-------------译者：逍遥俊马-审核者：龙腾翻译总管------------

Expand 3 more replies
MySetDancerJun 23rd 2015, 00:08
Nothing is more incompatible and compatible at the same time as China and Arab/Muslim countries. Both are essentially dictatorships but their underlying cultures despise each other's beliefs. They use different social mechanisms but both crush dissent as needed and are quick to take advantage of any situation which increases their power or self-perception.
Money can purchase cooperation.But China may find investments in Arab countries rather more risky than they are used to. Their investments can be appropriated at any time without compensation and without legal recourse. Terrorists can destroy investments while the "government" looks on.
I think they should be careful but if they lose, no one else will shed any tears.
 
对于中国和穆斯林中东国家之间并不存在兼不兼容的问题。 他们本质上都是独裁国家，但是潜在的文化冲突，让他们在对待信仰的问题上相互鄙视。他们用着不同的社会制度，但同样需要通过镇压异见来迅速的提高自身权力和自我认知上的优势。
钱是能带来合作。但是中国也许会发现，在阿拉伯国家投资所带来的风险远比他们以前做过的其他投资都要高。他们的投资在任何时候都可能失去回报，失去法律追述的权力。在“政府”的默许下，恐怖分子能破坏这些投资项目。
我认为他们应该小心些，因为如果他们失败了，没人会为他们落泪的。

台毒-害台湾in reply to MySetDancerJun 23rd 2015, 00:48
I skipped the rest of your post the moment seeing your "but their underlying cultures despise each other's beliefs".
Where did you get that uninformed and wrong idea? From the chronicles of the Crusades? That BTW  were fought between Islamic and Christian people.
China had had no "Crusade" with Arabs or Islamic people throughout the ancient and recent times.
 
回LS，
在我跳过你文章的时候，瞥见你说“但是潜在的文化冲突，让他们在对待信仰的问题上相互鄙视。”
你是从哪里达到这个愚昧而错误的想法啊？从《十字军东征编年史》？随便提一下，“十字军东征”是伊斯兰教和基督教教徒之间的战争。
从古至今，中国可是从来没有和阿拉伯人或者伊斯兰教人“十字军东征”过。