西方轰炸无法拯救叙利亚，而非西方的外交却有可能 [英国媒体]

-------------译者：地平线123-审核者：龙腾翻译总管------------



The past week has seemed like a bad rerun. For the third time in 15 years western countries led by the United States have taken military action against a majority Muslim Middle Eastern country. Support for intervention is not limited to the hard right: that Syria should be bombed was the mainstream view of the American foreign policy establishment along with Britain and France.

历史的悲剧似乎在过去的一周里再次上演。这是15年来在美国领导下的西方国家第三次对中东穆斯林大国采取军事行动。支持军事介入的不仅仅是极右翼势力：轰炸叙利亚是美英法三国外交政策制定的主流意见。

Let us be clear that the use of chemical weapons is a horrific crime. But we do not know the full story of what happened in Douma; to say this is not to engage in conspiracy theories but merely to admit that it has still been only a few days since the reports emerged. Yet there seems to be little interest among pro-interventionists in asking even basic questions or in allowing the UN to lead an investigation. We have been here before with the lies that led to the Iraq war but that precedent does not seem to deter western leaders as they seek yet again to rush to claim the moral high ground.

我们应该清楚使用化学武器是一项非常严重的罪行。但我们不知道杜马镇事件的来龙去脉；虽然不能说此次事件一定就和阴谋论有关，但自化武攻击报告发布以来这才过了短短数日。但赞成干预的人甚至对询问基本问题或允许联合国领导调查都毫无兴趣。我们之前也曾如此，那些谎言导致了伊拉克战争，但是过往的一切似乎无法阻止西方的领导人，因为他们再一次迫不及待地声称其拥有道德高地。

But if it is astounding that after failure in Afghanistan Iraq and Libya the west has chosen military intervention again what is just as disappointing is that the rest of the world continues to turn a blind eye. It is time for non-western countries to recognise that by not getting proactively involved in international diplomatic efforts on these big issues they relegate themselves to second-tier players and allow western leaders to define what “appropriate” and “responsible” actions are.

但是如果说在阿富汗、伊拉克和利比亚失败后，西方还选择军事干预的做法是令人震惊的话，那么其余国家对此继续视而不见则同样令人失望。非西方国家是时候意识到因为他们在这些重大议题上没有做出积极的外交努力，所以他们使自己成为了二流玩家，并允许西方领导人来定义什么是“恰当的”和“负责任的”行动。

There has been some progress. Long criticised for not living up to its global responsibilities as a major power in recent years China has expanded its foreign presence and soft power with the establishment of the Asian Infrastructure Investment Bank the Belt and Road Initiative and a greater presence in global peacekeeping forces. Or look at south-east Asia a region that has seen decades of interstate peace while being at least as ethnically and religiously diverse as the war-torn Middle East.

不过进步还是有的。作为世界大国，中国长期以来因没有履行其全球责任而备受指责。近年来，随着亚投行成立、一带一路倡议和其在全球维和部队中的存在扩大，中国外交存在和软实力都得到了提升。又或者看一看东南亚，它的民族和宗教多样性丝毫不逊于饱受战争之苦的中东，但是该地区已经享受了数十年的跨洲际和平。

-------------译者：梧桐pasky-审核者：龙腾翻译总管------------

But while governments as well as individuals across Africa and Asia are frustrated and angered by self-serving western actions most remain silent. And without alternative initiatives and engagement from non-western actors the west ends up monopolising the discussion. It is time politicians and diplomats in other parts of the world seized the initiative and stopped accepting their second-class status in the affairs of the world.

即使众多非洲和亚洲的ZF和人民都对西方自私自利的行为感到沮丧和愤怒，但大多数都保持缄默。因为没可替代的方案，也没有非西方的国家介入遏制，所以西方国家最终垄断了这场讨论。现在是时候让世界上其他国家的政治家和外交家掌握主动权，拒绝接受在世界政治事务中被看作“二等公民“了。

Western nations may resist the erosion of their influence. Remember how the west dismissed the brokering initiative of the African unx in Libya and instead resorted to military intervention? It is a firmly held yet rarely spoken view in western political and diplomatic circles that the rest of the world is unqualified to play any role in such crises – even though when it comes to understanding the root causes of many geopolitical tensions diplomats from countries that have been colonised or otherwise interfered with by foreign powers are surely better equipped than the former colonial powers to find solutions

西方国家也许会抵制其影响力的削弱。还记得西方国家驳回了非洲国家联盟在利比亚的代理倡议，取而代之采取军事手段的事吗？在西方政治外交圈里，世界上的其它国家不够资格在此类危机中扮演任何角色，这是一种固执且很少被人接受和提及的观点——尽管在涉及明白地缘政治紧张的根源时，那些被外国势力殖民或干扰的国家的外交官们绝对能够比那些前殖民国家更能够找到解决方案。

A high-level UN delegation not led by western diplomats but instead by others from Asia Africa and the Middle East working for the last few years with the Syrian government might well have found some solutions had President Assad been offered some form of guarantee that he would not meet the same fate as Saddam Hussein or Muammar Gaddafi.

高级联合国代表团不是由西方的外交官领导的，而是由亚洲、非洲以及中东外交官所领导的，同时这些外交官为叙利亚政府工作了至少几年，且很可能已找到了一些解决方法，向阿萨德总统做出了某种保证——即他不会遭遇同萨达姆·侯赛因或者穆阿迈尔·卡扎菲一样的命运。

After this latest strike by the west the rest of the world needs to say “enough is enough”. Large non-western countries or blocks such as India Japan China Asean (Association of Southeast Asian Nations) and others such as the African unx need to not just speak out against strikes as China already has but also work together to propose – and perhaps even implement – a different non-violent and diplomatic platform. Allowing the west to dictate terms is last century’s norm.

在叙利亚遭受西方最近的一次袭击之后，世界上的其他国家有必要说一声“够了！”。非西方国家或者地区（如印度、日本、东盟以及非洲联盟等）不能像中国那样只在口头上反对袭击，而是应该团结一致去提议——或者甚至是实现——一个独特的非暴力外交平台。允许西方发号命令已经是上个世纪的标准了。

-------------译者：战斗力为5-审核者：龙腾翻译总管------------

GutsandGlory 21h ago 
This war will only end when the Syrian armed forces win in the field there are no non-military solutions at this late stage in the war. Assad may be no angel but he's secular and far more desirable than a victory for Saudi/Qatari backed Jihadists.

这场战争只有在叙利亚武装力量在战场上取得胜利的时候才会结束，战争的后期可没有非军事解决方案。阿萨德或许不是天使，但他不信教，比沙特、卡塔尔支持的圣战组织获得胜利要令人满意得多。

Spillage93  GutsandGlory 20h ago 
It seems a bit perverse to describe a version of Ba'athism in which the Alawites rule unelected over a multi-faith nation as 'secular'.

将非选举产生的阿拉维派用来统治多信仰国家的复兴主义（一种阿拉伯民族主义意识形态）描述成“不信教”这有点不正当吧。

Besides Syria isn't truly 'secular'. The constitution says that the President must be a Muslim for goodness' sake.

此外，叙利亚并不是真的“不信教”。宪法规定总统务必是穆斯林才行。

EternallyUnimpressed  Spillage93 20h ago 
Compared to most of the region's countries and in particular the rebels within Syria Ba'athism is secular.

相比于该地区的大部分国家，特别是对叙利亚的叛军来说，复兴主义是“非宗教的”。

BMullard 21h ago
Here's an idea... Stop arming and funding 'Rebels' to attempt to overthrow the Assad government! If we did that the problems in that country would be drastically improved.

我有个主意…停止武装和资助那些试图推翻阿萨德政府的“叛军们”！如果我们能做到这点，那个国家的问题将会得到极大地改善。

HellHoundOnMyTrail  BMullard 21h ago
But 'rebels' is the euphemism for Jaish-al-Islam the head chopping heart eating Islamic fanatics which is more or less the same ideology which caused that piece of filth to blow himself up in Manchester murdering *our* people. *This* is who the UK government has lined itself up with. Not only is this policy counter-productive to ending the ongoing heartbreak for innocent Syrains(which is the most important factor)it's endangering *us* also as there's always blowback.

但“叛军”只是圣战组织的委婉说法，他们是砍人头吃人心的伊斯兰狂热分子，他们基本上和在曼彻斯特自杀式袭击我们的人有着同样的思想理念。我们英国政府与之为伍的就是这么一群乌合之众。这种政策不但没能结束无辜叙利亚人民遭受的持续苦难，还事与愿违反过来威胁着我们自己，因为凡事总是会有反作用。

Blenheim  HellHoundOnMyTrail 20h ago
Absolutely. Not one 'journalist' here in the UK has bothered to ask the question .. who are these people we're prepared to go to war for .. 

你说一点没错。在英国，没有一个“记者”会去问.....我们是准备为谁而战这样的问题.....

We're again placed in the firing line by a reckless Tory US obsessed government based on zero proof and seemingly at the behest of al-qaeda affiliates.

我们再次被鲁莽不计后果的、痴迷于保守思想的政府，在没有任何证明且表面上是在基地组织分支机构的授意下被推上了作战前线。

 -------------译者：战斗力为5-审核者：龙腾翻译总管------------

CaptainGrey 21h ago
It has been made clear time and again that the air strike would in no way stopor even slow the civil war. It was a hit on the chemical weapons factory in order to deter the use of chemical weapons in the future.

这再一次明确表示，空袭决不会停止，甚至会延缓内战。这次对化学武器工厂的袭击是为了防止将来使用化学武器。

By the way go ahead and try and find a non-west solution.

顺便一提，去试着找一个非西方的解决方案吧。

sokkynick  CaptainGrey 21h ago
...where firemen are wandering about with no protective clothing at all?

……消防员不穿防护服到处乱窜这是在搞啥？

steemonkey  CaptainGrey 20h ago
When are we going to bomb the Saudis?

我们什么时候轰炸沙特啊？

adognow  CaptainGrey 20h ago
"Chemical weapons factory" lol. Funny how all the Russian TV crews Syrian soldiers and all manner of people not wearing protective gear were walking around the ruins of the missile attakcs and yet nothing happened to them. No gas clouds no chemical residue no victims.

“化学武器工厂”哈哈。有趣的是所有的俄罗斯电视台工作人员、叙利亚士兵和各色各样的人都没戴护具，在导弹袭后的废墟随意走动，却没出任何事。没有烟气层（毒气），没有化学残留物，没有受害者。

And how the "White Helemets" were merrily rinsing "chemical weapons victims" off without even wearing disposable gloves aprons boots or face masks. Nothing happened to them either. And the fact that the "White Helmets" (conveniently founded by James Le Mesurier a former mercenary commander and UK military officer - how convenient I don't see any former UK military officers creating White Helmets in Iraq or Yemen) reported that one of the medical signs the "victims" of the "chemical attacks" was pupillary constriction. Sarin causes pupillary dilation instead. Oops. It's almost like a bunch of illiterate Salafists masquerading as rescue workers can't read a simple article on the signs and symptoms of organophosphate agent poisoning and correctly recite its effects.

“白头盔”（叙利亚民防组织）如此愉快地冲洗着“化学武器受害者们”，他们甚至没有穿戴一次性手套、围裙、靴子或口罩。然而他们什么事都没有。事实上，“白头盔”的报告称，遭受过“化学袭击”的受害者的临床表现之一是瞳孔收缩。（“白头盔”是由詹姆斯·李·梅热勒随手创建的，他是一名前雇佣兵指挥官和前英国军官——这还真是随意啊，我怎么就没见过其他英国前军官有在伊拉克或也门建立“白头盔”这样的组织呢。）相反，沙林毒气会导致瞳孔扩大。哎呀。好像是一群文盲萨拉菲圣战派在冒充救援人员呀，他们甚至都看不懂有关有机磷剂中毒的症状和体征的简单文章，也不能正确背诵其（对身体的）影响和后果。

Oh and Novichok. It is "reported to be 5–8 times more lethal than VX nerve agent and effects are rapid usually within 30 seconds to 2 minutes". And oddly all it did was make some bald overweight Russian chap doze off for a couple weeks after being able to have a pint at the local pub a meal at a local restaurant a stroll through a park and a drive from home hours after being supposedly "exposed". A "military-grade" chemical weapon three people "affected" no deaths and no lasting injuries. And yet a little VX was enough to snuff out Kim's half-brother like a candle.

噢，对了，还有诺维乔克神经毒剂。其报告称这“比VX神经毒剂致命5到8倍，而且起效更加迅速，通常30秒到2分钟内就会起效。”奇怪的是，在被诺维乔克毒剂攻击后，这些秃顶、超重的俄罗斯小伙子还能在当地酒馆喝一品脱酒，在当地餐馆用餐，在公园里散步，并在几小时后自己开车回家，事后也只是打了几周的瞌睡。一种“军用级”的化学武器，三人“受影响”，却没有一个人死亡，且没有一个人有永久性伤害。然而极小剂量的VX神经毒剂就跟吹灭一根蜡烛一般轻易得就杀死了金姆（Kim）同父异母/同母异父的兄弟。

Sounds pretty convenient probably like Saddam's "active chemical weapons program". And before you ask yes I am Russian bot. Privet tovarishch! Putin not pay in ruble is of weak currency. He pay in fish instead.

听起来还真是很随意，很可能就像萨达姆的“活性化学武器计划”一样。在你问问题之前，我先自我介绍下，是的，我是俄罗斯机器人。你好，同志（拉丁化俄语）！普京没用卢布付我钱，因为那是疲软的货币。他是用鱼来付我报酬的。

-------------译者：兔子无敌-审核者：龙腾翻译总管------------

JesusCakes 21h ago
You want China to get involved in the Middle East.

你想要中国参与到中东地区的局势来。

China.

中国。

A country with no democratically accountable government.
A country which is currently ramping up economic exploitation in Africa.
A country which is illegally occupying Tibet.
A country which has banned Muslim men from wearing beards in Xinjiang.
A country which is currently building military bases on reclaimed land for the sole purpose of intimidating its weaker geopolitical rivals at the same time they claim a huge swathe of sea based on bogus "historical" associations.
A country which illegally kidnaps booksellers who are critical of the government.
A country which censored Winnie-the-Pooh because of a harmless joke.

一个不实行民主问责制的国家。
一个正在非洲加大经济剥削的国家。
一个非法占据XZ的国家。
一个禁止穆斯林男性在XJ留胡须的国家。
一个为了恐吓弱小的政治地缘对手而在填海造地、修建军事基地，同时利用伪造的“历史”的证据以索取大片领海的国家。
一个非法绑架批评ZF的书商的国家。
一个因无伤大雅的小玩笑就审查删减小熊维尼的国家。

There is no level of contempt I can have for this article. It cannot be expressed with words.

我对这篇文章没有毫无鄙视之意，（对其的看法）无法用言语来表达。

And how about the wealthy Arab states do something for a change?

那么对此事，换富有的阿拉伯国家来做点什么吧？

sokkynick  JesusCakes 21h ago
You want the USA to get involved in Syria. Oh wait they are... illegally.

你想要美国参与到叙利亚局势中来。哦，等等，他们是.....非法的。

ArtfulDodger83 21h ago
The war will end when Assad Russia and Iran are allowed to do their job without our rabid attack dogs chippin in.

当我们狂热的战争狗不再搅局，让阿萨德、俄罗斯和伊朗他们各尽其职时，这场战争就会结束了。

sokkynick 21h ago
Wasn't aware that bomb first and ask questions later is part of the UN charter.
May will get punished on 5th May. A good 78% (22% agreed) of the country disagree with her approach.

先是称不知轰炸的存在，然后再来质问问题是联合国宪章（标准套路）的一部分。梅会在5月5日受到惩罚，英国有78%的人不同意（22%同意）她的做法。

EduardStreltsovGhost  sokkynick 21h ago
It's not it's in direct violation of International Law. But I won't expect to see Trump May or Macron hauled up to the ICJ.

这不是联合国宪章的内容，它直接违背了国际法。但是我不认为我们能看到特朗普、梅或者马克龙被传讯到国际法院的那天。

argotique  sokkynick 21h ago
This agrees with my own experience of listening to friends on both sides of the political debate - few people actually think bombing Syrian one day before UN inspectors were due to arrive was a 'good' solution to the problem. I wonder if this is why the Guardian has done an about-face on the issue and is now pretending it didn't support the strikes?

这和我倾听站在不同立场的朋友之间的政治辩论的经历是相符的——几乎没有人真的认为在联合国调查员到达的前一天袭击叙利亚是解决叙利亚问题的“好”方法。我想知道这是不是《卫报》突然改变在这一事件上的观点，现在只是假称自己不支持袭击的原因？

-------------译者：战斗力为5-审核者：龙腾翻译总管------------

Steenkensan 21h ago
Wasn′t "Agent orange" also some kind of chemical weapon? Why didn′t the west bomb American chemical factories during the Vietnam war?

不是说“橙剂”也是某种化学武器吗？为什么越南战争期间西方没有轰炸美国的化学工厂？

"Up to four million people in Vietnam were exposed to the defoliant. The government of Vietnam says as many as 3 million people have suffered illnesses because of Agent Orange The Red Cross of Vietnam estimates that up to 1 million people are disabled or have health problems as a result of Agent Orange contamination."(Wikipedia)

“在越南超过四百万人暴露在落叶剂中。越南政府表示，多达300万人患有因橙剂导致的疾病，据越南红十字会估计，由于橙剂的污染，多达100万人残疾或患有健康问题。”（维基百科）

EduardStreltsovGhost  Steenkensan 21h ago+46
Ssssshhhhh that's 'whataboutism'.

嘘，禁言，这就是所谓的“那么主义”。（川普最爱说的台词，“那么xx做了什么呢？”）

We don't want facts that point out our contradictions. We want to thump our chests and think we are doing the right thing.

我们不需要那种指出我们矛盾的事实。我们想捶胸顿足，认为我们现在做的是正当正确的事。（似乎是嘲讽）

Blenheim  Steenkensan 21h ago
The Yanks sold the gas to Saddam ... that he used with abandon against Iran. 
Hypocrites and liars of the first order .. and this one a vicars daughter?..

美国佬把毒气卖给了萨达姆…他在放弃与伊朗对抗时用了这毒气。伪君子和顶尖的骗子…这像是一个牧师的女儿（会做的事）吗？（指梅姨）..

Vin Diacola 21h ago
" But if it is astounding that after failure in Afghanistan Iraq and Libya the west has chosen military intervention again what is just as disappointing is that the rest of the world continues to turn a blind eye. "

“但是如果说在阿富汗、伊拉克和利比亚失败后，西方还选择军事干预的做法是令人震惊的话，那么其余国家对此继续视而不见则同样令人失望。”

The West has a choice. Either bomb Assad and risk the wrath of Iran and Russia or sit by and watch while Assad gasses his own population.

西方是有选择能选的，要么轰炸阿萨德，冒着伊朗和俄罗斯对此愤怒的风险，要么袖手旁观静看阿萨德毒死自己的人民。

That's it. No other options.

事情就是这样，没有其他选择。

Diplomacy has failed. 
International condemnation has failed. 
Telling Assad that he's no longer on our Xmas card list has failed.

外交失败了。国际谴责制裁失败了。请告诉阿萨德，他已经不在我们圣诞卡的名单之上了。

I can understand why so many people are against the bombing campaign but they need to realise the alternative is watching as Syria grinds to a long unpleasant bloody conclusion in which many more innocent civilians will die.

我能理解为什么这么多人反对空袭行动，但是他们需要意识到，另一种选择是干看着叙利亚走向一个长期的、苦痛血腥的结局，这个过程会造成更多无辜平民的死亡。

EduardStreltsovGhost  Vin Diacola 21h ago
Hardly. Assad is nearing victory in the years-long civil war and that is fundamentally what Western countries dislike.

不可能。阿萨德已经快要赢得这场持续多年的漫长内战，而这是西方国家完全不愿看到的情形。